Matrix Reloaded - SPOILERS Included!

[Grandmaster]

Originally posted by gonaads
Now the Archetect supposedly is the "father" of the Matrix. But isn't he also a program??? And if this is so, then who/what created him? Or did a machine create these programs?

Good question. I do not have an answer

 

[Sazar]

well considering through the animatrix we have sentient beings (ie sentient bots) why is it hard to imagine him as NOT being a sentient personality ?

obviously he is thinking logically and while he is not irrational (lack of emotions to the degree we feel) he will act when he feels there is a threat (like the first bot did when he killed those other people)

it should not be hard to imagine this as sort of a self defence protocol...

but whatever... lets wait till november to see if trinity is still sexeh or if jada pinkett gonna show us her nibletts

 

[gonaads]

We have "the Archetect" "the Oricle" "Merovingian" and "Persephone". They all seem to be from the begining of the Matrix.

Presephone is or always has been Merovingian's partner. The Archetect and the Oricle created the Matrix (well the Archetect did the first ones and the Oricle did or got the idea for the present one). So who created them???

And as the Archetect said, "the anomaly manifests itself in a being AKA "The One". who then goes through all these hoops to get to the decision of letting Zion get destroyed or humanity get anyalated. So the first 5 versions of this anomally do the "no brainer" and let Zion get f00ked. They choose so many to reproduce as the Archetect says and boom... Her we go again. But this time, Neo AKA "the anomally manifested in a being" comes to more than care for humanity, he is in love with one. I think that is the premiss to the KISS. The reason for this scene is that Persephone is a program that does indeed feed or more to the point, analizes emotion. She sets the whole chain of events in motion by doing this. Remember they have gone through this 5 times before. I think Persephone did it for the reason of feeling or analizing this new emotion. Before it was not love, now they are facing something different. And the way Neo does not do what the other versions did also throws the Archetect for a loop. Trinity should die, the Archetect knows she will die, The Oricle knows she will die. But she does not. Neo has changed the outcomes of everything that has always been the same for the other 5 times that the matrix has had to deal with this anomaly.

 

[gonaads]

Originally posted by Sazar
but whatever... lets wait till november to see if trinity is still sexeh or if jada pinkett gonna show us her nibletts

Hahahaha... Oooooo yeah!

 

[Grandmaster]

*Merovingian

In the West, Merovingian kings and queens laid the foundations for the formation of much of Europe. The Merovingian were Franks, a Germanic tribe, and like many other Germanic tribes they had served in the Roman military since the 4th century. Although they initially settled in the far northern regions of the Roman Empire, the Franks gradually moved south into what is today Belgium and northern France. At the end of the 5th century their king, Clovis I (whose grandfather, Merovech, gave his name to the dynasty), defeated the local Roman commander and took over his army, civil service, and lands. By 537 the Franks had conquered what is today France, Belgium, Switzerland, and northwestern Germany.

The mystique that surrounds them includes attributions of saintliness, magical powers (derived from their long red hair), and even divine origin, stemming from their supposed descent from the one and only Jesus Christ.

* Persephone

Persephone, in Greek mythology, daughter of Zeus, father of the gods, and of Demeter, goddess of the earth and of agriculture. Hades, god of the underworld, fell in love with Persephone and wished to marry her. Although Zeus gave his consent, Demeter was unwilling. Hades, therefore, seized the maiden as she was gathering flowers and carried her off to his realm. As Demeter wandered in search of her lost daughter, the earth grew desolate. All vegetation died, and famine devastated the land. Finally Zeus sent Hermes, the messenger of the gods, to bring Persephone back to her mother. Before Hades would let her go, he asked her to eat a pomegranate seed, the food of the dead. She was thus compelled to return to the underworld for one-third of the year. As both the goddess of the dead and the goddess of the fertility of the earth, Persephone was a personification of the revival of nature in spring.

Just some food for thought And good post gonaads

 

[Grandmaster]

Originally posted by Khayman
Reposting the same things over and over again can't be interesting for anybody, I think we need to agree to disagree on this one as no on is budging and then move on to other aspect of the film

Oh and IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT YOU THINK!
/me raises the peoples eyebrow
i'll close what i damn well feel like (Until the bigger boys tell me not to any more

Well you know that a movie is really good when you have so much discussion about it ;P

 

[Khayman]

Here's an interesting idea a friend told me. You know the council bloke Neo was talking to when he couldn't sleep (I forget names).
Wouldn't it be interesting if he was he previous "One" and the other members of the council are the ones he picked from the Matrix to restart Zion.
I haven't done the count of the people in the council or the number of men and women but it seemed like and interesting idea if it works out.

I think Merovingian will play a key role in this somehow, or at least I hope he does. He was the first one to mention Neo's predecessors, and said he survived them, so maybe he knows something.

Oh an check out the new Oracle for Revolutions here

 

[gonaads]

I like this part from the conversation between Niobe and the Oracle in the "Enter the Matrix" video game...

Oracle: The Merovingian warned me, that If I made a certain choice it would cost me. He is, among other things, a man of his word.

Niobe: What was the choice?

Oracle: The same one you yourself will have to make: The choice to help Neo or not.

Niobe: Then Neo is still alive?

Oracle: Yes, he touched the source and seperated his mind from his body. Now he lies trapped in a place between your world and ours.

Niobe: Can we free him?

Oracle: Trinity can, but she will have to fight her way through hell to do it.

Niobe: Can I help?

Oracle: That's why I called you. I cannot tell you what is going to happen. All I can do is hope that if given the chance, you will find the courage to do what you can.

Niobe: You once told me you knew everything you needed to.

Oracle: I do. I knew everything from the begining of this path to the end.

Niobe: I don't understand.

Oracle: Even I can't see beyond the end.

Niobe: The end? Are you trying to tell me the world is going to end?

Oracle: Yes. If we cannot save it, it will end.

Niobe: You mean Neo.

Oracle: I mean we. The path of "the one" is made by the many. I have a role to play just as you have yours.

This taken from "here"

 

[gonaads]

Originally posted by Khayman
Here's an interesting idea a friend told me. You know the council bloke Neo was talking to when he couldn't sleep (I forget names).
Wouldn't it be interesting if he was he previous "One" and the other members of the council are the ones he picked from the Matrix to restart Zion.
I haven't done the count of the people in the council or the number of men and women but it seemed like and interesting idea if it works out.

I think Merovingian will play a key role in this somehow, or at least I hope he does. He was the first one to mention Neo's predecessors, and said he survived them, so maybe he knows something.

Good point but I don't think the other "the ones" survived (???) only the people that were picked to repopulate.

 

[Sazar]

Originally posted by gonaads
Good point but I don't think the other "the ones" survived (???) only the people that were picked to repopulate.

quite right..

I believe in the first movie it was mentioned the fella who had previously disconnected them had died... though I am not sure on this point...

 

[Khayman]

I think they said the guy who as first born inside the matrix and freed the first of them died (an the oracle said he would return).
Maybe that was the last "One" or maybe it was the first "One"

 

[Sazar]

Originally posted by Khayman
I think they said the guy who as first born inside the matrix and freed the first of them died (an the oracle said he would return).
Maybe that was the last "One" or maybe it was the first "One"

my thing is... if neo is not the first "the one" and there have been 5 before him... therefore won't he be "the six" and the last guy who freed the original peeps @ zion be "the five"

don't they know anything about serializing in the matrix ?

 

[gonaads]

Interesting, but as o_87 put it in his post, Trinity types in the code and the last portion of it is "5"... well it means "5". Remember, Zion at that moment is version 5. Neo is version 6 but the destruction of Zion has not occured yet hence "5".

Stranger thing to come.

 

[Grandmaster]

Originally posted by gonaads
Interesting, but as o_87 put it in his post, Trinity types in the code and the last portion of it is "5"... well it means "5". Remember, Zion at that moment is version 5. Neo is version 6 but the destruction of Zion has not occured yet hence "5".

Stranger thing to come.

Yep, that post makes much more sense now..

The council has more women than men too. If I ever watch the movie again, I'll count the number of men and women. Maybe as the Architect said, that if Neo chose the right door then he would get 16 women and 9(7?) men to repopulate Zion. Maybe they were these original inhabitants? They are quite old looking too if I remember correctly..

 

[inso]

Sorry to bring this back up, but I just saw the movie last night and I haven't looked at this thread until now.

dealer: I respect your theory, but I do not agree with it.

Look at the scene with Persephone at a different angle. Look at the situation as if he didn't kiss her to get the keymaker, or even to save humankind, but he did it to save Trinity.

If he did not kiss her, they wouldn't have gotten the keymaker (considering Neo had no other choice), and in the end everyone would have died, including Trinity.

So basically, it was kiss her or Trinity would die, and I'm sure that Trinity would agree with Neo's decision in the end.

--- Now, I have a question: What the hell were those albino Bob Marley twin things?

 

[gonaads]

Ghosts in the machine

 

[sboulema]

they were guardians of the keymaker and worked for the merovingian guy.

 

[Sazar]

they're english

/me points @ EP

nuff said

 

[Kr0m]

Hey.. remember when Neo, Morpheus & Trinity first entered the restaurant to see Merovingian. As they entered, the camera panned to their left and it showed for a brief moment someone being escorted out. At that same time Neo got that spidey sense tingling sound. I wonder if the guy that was escorted out was of any importance.

 

[Sazar]

just watched it again... this time on Imax screen

it looks so much better...

sound is AMAZING...

only downside was that the place was ridiculously cold

least the hot blonde next to me had her nibblets peeking

heh... every cloud has a silver lining