Do you believe in God? Anything after death?

[Nick M]

Each to his own it is.

 

[ZAnwar]

Originally posted by Benny
ummm, you saying i should buy some sunscreen?

kidding m8

to each his own i guess.

Ha, nah but that is the thing, what do you think will happen to you when you die?

 

[Sazar]

Originally posted by gonaads
Soooo Sazar if I died on the operating table and was dead for... say... 10mins. and then I was revived/brought back to life. You say that I'm still dead??? and not alive any more???

like I stated (clearly I thought) death on the operating table per your definition is a medical death... clinically dead or whatever per the doctors...

death to me is that you have ceased to be... if you are on the operating table and are declared clinically dead and then come back... that is not dieing... IMO...

death for me is a permanent thing...

 

[Tabula Rasa]

Nothing, and i'm damn happy about it!

When your body stops to function your mind stops as well, and at that point you die.
Its an experience that none can explain, for the simple reason that the human brain can not understand what it means for it to "die" sense when it is dead, it cant "understand" nothing.

 

[Nick M]

Originally posted by ZAnwar
Ha, nah but that is the thing, what do you think will happen to you when you die?

I don't know what will happen. But something will. Good? Bad? I'll find out.

 

[Sazar]

Originally posted by ZAnwar
I don't want to offend nobody either but I have to say what I believe!!!!!!!

I was born in the UK, a muslim. My parents told me to worship God, obey and think good thoughts. I am 15 and still I think it is my duty to believen in God as Islam is a monotheistic (monotheistic= believing in one true god) religion like Christianity and Judaism. What I don't get is (people don't be offended), how can you not believe in God! Why is Islam the fastest growing religion in the world? There has to be a God or why will people convert to Islam where we believe there is one true God. The world started off with 2 religions, Christianity and Judaism. The Jews were first Allah's (my God (Allah= God in Arabic)) people. We (muslims) didn't exist then. When the Jews started disobeying Allah, like gambling, drinking Alcohol, committing Adultery, comparing objects to God etc, Allah put them in a severe problem. This problem was that as they were no longer Allah's people, their destiny was hell, same as the Christians. Then the muslims came and they were the chosen people who would eventually enter Paradise (Heaven).

There are 72 sects in Christianity and 73 sects in Islam. In Islam out of the 73 sects, there is one that will go to heaven, that sect will obey God and follow the teachings of the Prophet Mohammad. Right now, the sect I believe in ('Sunni') will be the only sect to enter paradise. This is all true, you can find this info, in the Torah, the First Bible (the unchanged one) and of course the Quran. Every religion is from Allah, and every religion will go to hell unless it is Islam.


After Death:

I believe that every non-believer (kaffir), this can be a hindu, Buddha, anyone that does not believe in Allah will go to hell. Only Muslims will stay for a short while, it says in the Quran that every muslim will go to hell to get a taste of what the non-believers will get for eternity. Only the deserving will go to Heaven eventually!!!!!

and hence we have an issue to discuss

islam and christianity are NOT older than other religions that have existed from before...

the egyptians had a culture/ "religion" and had gods to help explain things that they did not understand... it is just the way it was...

now coming to people...

IMO (and I reiterate all the thoughts I express on this thread are MY opinion) islam and all other religions have some very good points... but the teaching of the people who are considered the vessels to distribute this informations... pundits/priests/imams... whosoever... they are expressing THEIR version of what they believe the teachings should be... if the religions were so clearly devised there would not be so many different versions/followings of it...

religion IMO is a good thing in many ways because there are many people who need to be guided through life and if the teachings of their religious institution is what will guide them along this path... so be it...

all religious 'books' are written by people and this cannot be discounted.. there are no 'technical' descriptions of activities that took place... there is no historical evidence to support what happened unless you believe in it... and I don't...

there are far too many discrepencies in the texts to hold FACTUAL reasoning for me... not just one particular one... but all of them...

in that sense the Ba'hai faith is perhaps the most modern and assimilating and also one of the fastest growing faiths in the world...

IMO if I am tolerant of peoples who follow a faith and of religions that are followed as well... I would expect to receive the same consideration for my beliefs (or non-belief... whatever you may count it as being)...

I detest being preached to and told I am going to hell because I don't believe in the exact same thing that someone else has read in a book...

I know I am going to die someday... there is no guarantee on that... there are just too many variables for me to consider... without factoring in that I have to rethink my ENTIRE existence based on what some lad/lass told me I should do else I would not be happy AFTER I died...

I am more than content to be happy now and not have to deal with that

 

[ZAnwar]

No but, Nick, Benny and Sazar, you cannot ignore the obvious facts.

When somebody dies they have to be judged by Allah, no matter who they are. This will then determine if you will stay in hell or you will go to heaven eventually.

No offense but when you die, your body stays here and your soul goes up to Allah. Without your soul you can't do jacksh!t, you can't speak, see, sense, feel! You can't do anything. When a person dies, they can't just stay in their body and think they will be in a deep sleep for eternity, their has to be something after that, there just has to be. This life is a test, whether we do good or bad things, it is up to us. This a test for the after life, good = heaven and bad = hell!

 

[Tabula Rasa]

ZAnwar, these are only facts to you..
i am sure that you aren't arguing just for the sakes of it, and have a good intention. But , i am not a religious man, and have no reason to be one (at least thats what i believe).

 

[ZAnwar]

Originally posted by Sazar


all religious 'books' are written by people and this cannot be discounted.. there are no 'technical' descriptions of activities that took place... there is no historical evidence to support what happened unless you believe in it... and I don't...

In the Quran, Torah and the unchanged Bible there are events that happened after the books were revealed to humanity. Some scientists state that they take guidance from the Quran about natural phenomenons. Once I again I state, all religions are from Allah, one is right. All these books are from Allah, they are practically the same but there is one major significance, they all talk about the last prophet of Islam, Prophet Muhammad. The Quran was revealed to the Prophet Mohammad, he was uneducated but still Allah had given him the ability to read the scriptures!

 

[ZAnwar]

Originally posted by Benny
ZAnwar, these are only facts to you..
i am sure that you aren't arguing just for the sakes of it, and have a good intention. But , i am not a religious man, and have no reason to be one (at least thats what i believe).

Yeah but you are not getting what I mean, people who have very strong faith in Allah will be the survivors come Judgement Day. I have to admit that I am ver weak in belief but I am hopefully building it up. People who don't believe will go to Hell, I am not trying to criticise what you think and am not trying to be funny, that is the fact! Look it up, do some research, you will find out!

 

[Tabula Rasa]

Well, I don't plan to convert to Islam any time soon.
I have read most of the bible, parts of the Quran, some of the new testimony. And there was nothing there to convince me of the being of god, haven, hell, an afterlife or some kind of supreme being.

You are entitled to have your own opinion, and i am entitled to have my.

I don't think that people should try to convert others by force, I think that holly wars will be the end of us all, but are a part of every large religion , and for that fact i tend to dislike any religion.

But if there is a god up there, i'd sure like to have a conversation with him and a baseball bat (no offense again).

 

[ZAnwar]

Originally posted by Benny
Well, I don't plan to convert to Islam any time soon.
I have read most of the bible, parts of the Quran, some of the new testimony. And there was nothing there to convince me of the being of god, haven, hell, an afterlife or some kind of supreme being.

You are in title to have your own opinion, and i am in title to have my.

I don't think that people should try to convert others by force, I think that holly wars will be the end of us all, but are a part of every large religion , and for that fact i tend to dislike any religion.

But if there is a god up there, i'd sure like to have a conversation with him and a baseball bat (no offense again).

You are entitled to your opinion, no doubt!

 

[Burpster]

GOD = yes
Religion = no

i dont believe that god looks more favorably on one group than another! i think it all boils down to the individual and how that person lives their life

Religion is just another way to keep people divided

Religion is nothing more than mind control ...noone needs religion to tell them whats rite and wrong


as for life after death ...who cares?? it will sort itself out after your dead

 

[Nick M]

Originally posted by ZAnwar
No but, Nick, Benny and Sazar, you cannot ignore the obvious facts.

When somebody dies they have to be judged by Allah, no matter who they are. This will then determine if you will stay in hell or you will go to heaven eventually.

No offense but when you die, your body stays here and your soul goes up to Allah. Without your soul you can't do jacksh!t, you can't speak, see, sense, feel! You can't do anything. When a person dies, they can't just stay in their body and think they will be in a deep sleep for eternity, their has to be something after that, there just has to be. This life is a test, whether we do good or bad things, it is up to us. This a test for the after life, good = heaven and bad = hell!

That's the thing Zanwar. To you, these are facts, and you deeply believe in them.

If I die, and my soul goes up God, as you say, you believe that you can not speak, sense, feel. That you can't do anything.

I don't believe in that. What you described is more known to me as black out death, you're nothing, nobody, no more. I do not believe in that, and if anyone does, I pity them, life must be terrible.

 

[Jahya]

I pose this question, if there is this "one true god" be it god the father of jesus, creator of all etc etc or allah, or mohamed (sp?), buddha, or that other cow over there ---> then why doesn't he/she/it make its presence known and unite the world? maybe in fact, if there is a god, she/he/it is actually a cruel and hearltess god that gets off on suffering and pain? maybe in the "war of heaven" satan actually won, but no one was left to tell the story (besides those who would want to hide the truth) so we as dumb humans still believe in this god that was slain at the hands of usurper....just a thought.

one other thought, and please do not take offense at this, I admit I am not knowledgeable enough about the muslim religion to make much of a point here, but based on what I have read in this thread and other sources, reckless beliefs like that indicated previousy that all non muslims will go to hell is the exact reason why "holy wars" are fought. no one wants to believe that because they were born non muslim they will go to hell and on their way potentially be killed by a muslim who is doing their duty to rid the world of "infidels"....isn't that basically saying that even though as a child you had no say, and you were born/raised christian or whatever god has condemned you to hell for a choice you never had? or because you did not choose to convert to a religion that you may have never been educated (or falsely educated) about? I think we are all well aware of how easily things can be twisted....especially when it will make more money, or give more power to a person or organization.


again, to reiterate, I am in no way trying to knock anyone's beliefs, more specifically in this case, our muslim friends on this forum. I firmly beleive in "live and let live" but as someone who was raised christian, against my will, and forced through 12 years of christian schools and beliefs, I just don't get it....maybe there is a god, and maybe i will go to this hell when I die for my non belief (among other sins like premarital sex, drugs, blasphemy, etc)....but organized religion has killed that god, who should know what to believe?? I don't....so I made my own beliefs. I believe in NOTHING except me, myself and I because I refuse to kneel down and pray to an invisible being that has never shown me anything in a time of need when getting off my knees and taking action will resolve the situation or at least I can die trying (with pride) rather than kneeling down and accepting what some god that some human made up decides should be my fate. No, I have the power and control of my own destiny, and I will not give it to an invisible man/woman/child/dog/whatever.

Screw it...I'm rambling and any point I had to start with is now lost...

 

[Jahya]

as for life after death ...who cares?? it will sort itself out after your dead

Good answer

 

[New Disease]

Originally posted by Jahya
I pose this question, if there is this "one true god" be it god the father of jesus, creator of all etc etc or allah, or mohamed (sp?), buddha, or that other cow over there ---> then why doesn't he/she/it make its presence known and unite the world? maybe in fact, if there is a god, she/he/it is actually a cruel and hearltess god that gets off on suffering and pain? maybe in the "war of heaven" satan actually won, but no one was left to tell the story (besides those who would want to hide the truth) so we as dumb humans still believe in this god that was slain at the hands of usurper....just a thought.

one other thought, and please do not take offense at this, I admit I am not knowledgeable enough about the muslim religion to make much of a point here, but based on what I have read in this thread and other sources, reckless beliefs like that indicated previousy that all non muslims will go to hell is the exact reason why "holy wars" are fought. no one wants to believe that because they were born non muslim they will go to hell and on their way potentially be killed by a muslim who is doing their duty to rid the world of "infidels"....isn't that basically saying that even though as a child you had no say, and you were born/raised christian or whatever god has condemned you to hell for a choice you never had? or because you did not choose to convert to a religion that you may have never been educated (or falsely educated) about? I think we are all well aware of how easily things can be twisted....especially when it will make more money, or give more power to a person or organization.


again, to reiterate, I am in no way trying to knock anyone's beliefs, more specifically in this case, our muslim friends on this forum. I firmly beleive in "live and let live" but as someone who was raised christian, against my will, and forced through 12 years of christian schools and beliefs, I just don't get it....maybe there is a god, and maybe i will go to this hell when I die for my non belief (among other sins like premarital sex, drugs, blasphemy, etc)....but organized religion has killed that god, who should know what to believe?? I don't....so I made my own beliefs. I believe in NOTHING except me, myself and I because I refuse to kneel down and pray to an invisible being that has never shown me anything in a time of need when getting off my knees and taking action will resolve the situation or at least I can die trying (with pride) rather than kneeling down and accepting what some god that some human made up decides should be my fate. No, I have the power and control of my own destiny, and I will not give it to an invisible man/woman/child/dog/whatever.

Screw it...I'm rambling and any point I had to start with is now lost...

thats one helliva post

 

[gonaads]

Originally posted by ZAnwar
I don't want to offend nobody either but I have to say what I believe!!!!!!!

I was born in the UK, a muslim. My parents told me to worship God, obey and think good thoughts. I am 15 and still I think it is my duty to believen in God as Islam is a monotheistic (monotheistic= believing in one true god) religion like Christianity and Judaism. What I don't get is (people don't be offended), how can you not believe in God! Why is Islam the fastest growing religion in the world? There has to be a God or why will people convert to Islam where we believe there is one true God. The world started off with 2 religions, Christianity and Judaism. The Jews were first Allah's (my God (Allah= God in Arabic)) people. We (muslims) didn't exist then. When the Jews started disobeying Allah, like gambling, drinking Alcohol, committing Adultery, comparing objects to God etc, Allah put them in a severe problem. This problem was that as they were no longer Allah's people, their destiny was hell, same as the Christians. Then the muslims came and they were the chosen people who would eventually enter Paradise (Heaven).

There are 72 sects in Christianity and 73 sects in Islam. In Islam out of the 73 sects, there is one that will go to heaven, that sect will obey God and follow the teachings of the Prophet Mohammad. Right now, the sect I believe in ('Sunni') will be the only sect to enter paradise. This is all true, you can find this info, in the Torah, the First Bible (the unchanged one) and of course the Quran. Every religion is from Allah, and every religion will go to hell unless it is Islam.


After Death:

I believe that every non-believer (kaffir), this can be a hindu, Buddha, anyone that does not believe in Allah will go to hell. Only Muslims will stay for a short while, it says in the Quran that every muslim will go to hell to get a taste of what the non-believers will get for eternity. Only the deserving will go to Heaven eventually!!!!!

That is an interesting point of view... unfortunately it is tainted with you religious beliefs. I have and never will have anything whatsoever against anyones beliefs. But to really have an objective outlook on this topic is hard to do. One one side you have the people that do not believe in any type of God or Supreme Being... on the other side there are the people that beieve in a god but a god of their own religious making.

ZAnwar, you say as to the way that you have been raised and taught, that the sect that you are a part of is the one to go to heaven (if there is such a place). What about those that are a part of the other sects??? Arn't they going to say the same thing... that they are the ones to go the heaven???

Plus all mass Religion has their fanatical following, the ones that are so self richious about the Religion they practice that anyone else is a heithin or evil or a demonic worshiper. And yes there are some that their Religion is the worshop of the Devil/Satan/The Evil One, etc... They, the fanatics will destroy, persecute and kill others in the name of their religious beliefs. No Religion... NOT ONE depicts the killing of another human being because of them not believing. All religions depict harmony, love of one another, peace and understanding, living in tranquillity, being kind to each other, sharing, and so on. So how is it that those people... those fanatics can say that they are the chosen few to enter into heaven. Kinda doesn't make sence, especially if their religious writing that they follow so well does not say that. Religion is all intepetation and it is interpeted by Humans. And we all know that we all make mistakes and that we alway see thing to our on advantage. So is the way religion is followed by all these different people being followed correctly??? Again, it is all interpetation. The Religious Leaders are the ones that create policy for it to be followed. But they are Human, not God like or anything else... Some would now argue that this is not true that they are above all the rest. But they are Human with all the weaknessess of being a Human. NO ONE IS PERFECT... NO ONE.

Now, who's to say the Heaven and Hell are not here... Meaning that this world, our lives as we live them are Heaven and Hell respectively. The way you live your life is your own Heaven or Hell. Hmmmmmm... Interesting isn't it. And then when you die that's it, party's over, check out time. Or that maybe we do have a soul, an entity within each and every one of us that at the point of death/dieing it is then recycled into another newly born person... The ultimate in recycling.

In all religions of any kind they always speak of a Heaven and a Hell, in one form or another. Heaven is bliss and Hell is suffering and pain. Our lives are sometimes bliss and sometimes sufferiong and pain.

Soooooo???

 

[ZAnwar]

Originally posted by Jahya
I pose this question, if there is this "one true god" be it god the father of jesus, creator of all etc etc or allah, or mohamed (sp?), buddha, or that other cow over there ---> then why doesn't he/she/it make its presence known and unite the world? maybe in fact, if there is a god, she/he/it is actually a cruel and hearltess god that gets off on suffering and pain? maybe in the "war of heaven" satan actually won, but no one was left to tell the story (besides those who would want to hide the truth) so we as dumb humans still believe in this god that was slain at the hands of usurper....just a thought.

one other thought, and please do not take offense at this, I admit I am not knowledgeable enough about the muslim religion to make much of a point here, but based on what I have read in this thread and other sources, reckless beliefs like that indicated previousy that all non muslims will go to hell is the exact reason why "holy wars" are fought. no one wants to believe that because they were born non muslim they will go to hell and on their way potentially be killed by a muslim who is doing their duty to rid the world of "infidels"....isn't that basically saying that even though as a child you had no say, and you were born/raised christian or whatever god has condemned you to hell for a choice you never had? or because you did not choose to convert to a religion that you may have never been educated (or falsely educated) about? I think we are all well aware of how easily things can be twisted....especially when it will make more money, or give more power to a person or organization.


again, to reiterate, I am in no way trying to knock anyone's beliefs, more specifically in this case, our muslim friends on this forum. I firmly beleive in "live and let live" but as someone who was raised christian, against my will, and forced through 12 years of christian schools and beliefs, I just don't get it....maybe there is a god, and maybe i will go to this hell when I die for my non belief (among other sins like premarital sex, drugs, blasphemy, etc)....but organized religion has killed that god, who should know what to believe?? I don't....so I made my own beliefs. I believe in NOTHING except me, myself and I because I refuse to kneel down and pray to an invisible being that has never shown me anything in a time of need when getting off my knees and taking action will resolve the situation or at least I can die trying (with pride) rather than kneeling down and accepting what some god that some human made up decides should be my fate. No, I have the power and control of my own destiny, and I will not give it to an invisible man/woman/child/dog/whatever.

Screw it...I'm rambling and any point I had to start with is now lost...

You are mistaken, we talk to Allah (not because were are mad), we talk to him through our 5 daily prayers.

Everybody who is a non-muslim or non-believer will go to hell, that is the end!

 

[gonaads]

Originally posted by ZAnwar
You are mistaken, we talk to Allah (not because were are mad), we talk to him through our 5 daily prayers.

Everybody who is a non-muslim or non-believer will go to hell, that is the end!

I respect your beliefs and thoughts... But I believe we live Heaven and Hell in our daily lives and that is the end. To me and me alone.

I will not force my view on anyone in any way nor try to state that everyone else is bad or evil because my interpitation of my religion is such. I live my life and everyone else can live theirs the way they wish to live. I will not say to anyone that they are going to Hell. That in itself is not thoughts of a peaceful nor kind God or religious belief. That is just what we do in everyday life.

Maybe this life we live is your Heaven and it is my Hell. We will all know exactly what is what when we ALL die. But I truthfully do not what to have bragging rights on dieing first and then saying, "Wow, my way WAS the rite one". Or, "Wow, I was wrong it's not the way I was taught it was to be". I want to live as long as I can , then I'll find out what is what. :happy: