Firstly I don't use windows messenger. Prior to installing sp1 I renamed the messenger folder to 'messengeroff'. The shortcut to it in the start menu lost the icon & I left it there in case I wanted to use it. Anyway after a clean install of xp & sp1 I again named the folder 'messengeroff'. Now when I look in the start menu the messenger icon is still associated with the shortcut. It does not pop up when I open Outlook Express. When I clicked the shortcut icon it went looking for the messenger program, then stopped searching but I can't see what it did. Anybody else who turns off messenger that way noticed this??