To kermit about the ti4200

Discussion in 'Graphics Cards' started by Genius_overide, Aug 3, 2003.

  1. Hi Kermit,

    I allso have a MSI Ti4200 x8 and I am useing the 43.45 detonators from the MSI site and then I went to the omega site the other day and installed there latest driver over the top if it and I chose to have the omega set on quility as I get good frame rates and can afford to do this without getting a big hit, I have a 2500+ 333fsb barton and 512@ 333mhz and my mobo is a gigabyte- GA7 VA - KT400, I was just going to ask as you seem to know you vid cards what you think wouyld be the best thing to do to get the full potential out of this ti4200 on my system, I did notice when installing the omega driver set that it made all the difference in the quility department, so is there any other tricks you can let me know of with this card. As it gose when I go into my bios it wont let me set a higher freq for my ram so i carn't overclock it that way and dont know weather its a known thing with this board or what, seen as though my cpu is on 166 the same as my ram I think you get better proformance when they are both kept the same so what I wanted to do was set them both a little higher but because the bios wont let me change the ram freq I dont want to do this unless there is another way in which I can do this what is just as good, I asume it is the bios and not the ram that stops me from chaging the freq on the ram, anyway back to the point if you can give me some good pointers on the ti4200 I would be gratfull.
     
  2. Shamus MacNoob

    Shamus MacNoob Moderator Political User

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    Wow I am flattered that you picked me out of the crowd :)

    Now what can we do to get all the juice outta that card? Seeing as you got the omega's you will find in the video card properties that the clock can be adjusted. Also with the omega's ( not sure about the 44.03 ) because he was having trouble with that set, but the 43.45 also has the artifact tester with it. So in the settings for the card you can overclock the mem and core. Now how much is the question? I have found that I can go as high as 297/597 with this card , but its never the same on all puters. So its all about testing at each new level thats were artifact tester comes in to see if its a clean overclock, if you get alot of errors you need to back off a little. Next is cooling what kind of fan you got on that card? Me I took the stock fan off the first week and got a G4 mode cooler from thermaltake

    http://www.thermaltake.com/products/chipset/g4coolmod.htm

    I over volt the card in bios from default 1.5v to 1.6 and have been testing different settings but have yet to find any real benifits so I wont bother with them here.

    You can read this if you like
    http://www.tweak3d.net/articles/aperture-size/index.shtml

    mine is set to 128mb

    I need to go read up on your mobo to be sure about what else you might be able to do as for as overclocking in general ... what you said about ram=to fsb is 100% correct if you cannot raise the fsb and the ram in equal amounts then you would most likley end up creating a bottleneck. So I will read up on your mobo in spare time and see what I can find out.

    But please feel free to ask advice from all the great people on this site, I am flattered you asked me for my opinion but I know there are a great bunch of people here all more than willing to help and the more heads the better.






    :) :)
     
  3. jumpy

    jumpy Guest

    Thats the AGP voltage in your bios right? AFAIK agp voltage has nothing to do with overclocking ability of your vid card. AGP voltage is often increased to improve overall stability on high system overclocks. To achieve higher clocks you would actually have to physically volt mod your card :)

    Genius_overide, the frequency of your ram is directly related to your system fsb, but it's strange that there isn't a 3:4 divider or the like. What kind of ram have you got? If you have pc3200 ram or higher you'd achieve better performance by dropping the multiplier of your cpu and increasing the fsb to around 200mhz if possible. The ram would therefore be running at higher speeds due to the higher fsb.
    Good luck :)
     
  4. Shamus MacNoob

    Shamus MacNoob Moderator Political User

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    Yes I over volt beacuse I overclock as you can see in the sig
     
  5. jumpy

    jumpy Guest

    But of course you do ;) Who in their right mind wouldn't :D
    My system is generally more stable with 1.6Vagp (epox 4pea, p4 1.8@2.6ghz)
     
  6. Shamus MacNoob

    Shamus MacNoob Moderator Political User

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    Looking at some info about your MOBO

    Seems you can change the mulitpliers ( clocks ) ie 13 X 166 , 12 x 166, with dip switches on the board, for advanced options in your bios go into bios and hit CTRL + F1 and then go look in the advanced section , can you adjust ram timings? smaller values = better performance ie: 7-3-3-3 is slower than 6-2-2-2 now thing is here is also to know what values are valid for your sticks. Can ealisly be found. Another thing in your advanced bios settings is there an option to set the RAM speed? There should be 1:1 or 100% is best imho. Now your might be set to speed but I dunno if you have these options your gonna have to look and get back with that. What is the ram spec? Is it PC2700, PC3200, if you want to go over your default 333 its better to have ram sticks that are higher PC3200 = 400Mhz but if it is good ram you can always get a little more out of it like mine is PC3200 =400Mhz but I can get 420mhz stable with a little juice added to vdimm. And another point if you really want to start overclocking I suggest you read all the info you can find, You will need a better than stock heatsink and Fan for the cpu thats for sure.
     
  7. Kermit I have the same fan on my card that came with it but it seems to be pritty good, its the msi one but it covers most of the card and it allso came with heatsink aswell whitch covers most of the card fromt and back so it has pritty good cooling anyway so I dont think I will change that, My card was one of the better ones in its line when it comes to looks and cooling and it has the dvi-i connector and video_in and tv out ect...., I think when you get a ti with good cooling and heatsink you pay an extra 20 pound for it as I could have had a chaintec for 20 poud less but it just had a little fan on compaired to the one i have on now, anyway thanks for taking time to help, I am pritty good with computers as it gose but there is areas for improvment and this is the first time I have had a gforce as I normally have radeons and rage 3D used to do all the overclocking work for you with them, I have done system support and stuff and am on level 2 at the moment so i know my way around a pc but you just seemed to know more about these ti cards than my from what I ahve read from you posts so I thought I would ask if you had any ideas, thanks and hope you get back soon with any ideas.

    To the other guy I am useing 512 of pc2700 and it is branded dane-elec which is about the same price as kingston and I have had kingston before and it proformes about the same as this dane-elec which is branded ram. anyway there is some settings in the bios I can change when I press ctrl + f1 it gives me the advanced bios settings but when I go into voltage control some of the settings are there but they are not high-lighted and it wont allow me to click on them and I am hopeing there is a way to get rond this and I am working on that now, and the settings I want to change I carn't get at like the ram to change it from 166 to some higher settings then that will give me the way to do my cpu aswell but because i carn't change fsb on my ram there is no point in dong my cpu either.
     
  8. Shamus MacNoob

    Shamus MacNoob Moderator Political User

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    Two great little apps you can try for tweaking your Ti4200 are nvhardpage and !Atuner

    And a good soucre for you would be

    http://www.guru3d.com

    They have all the files and drivers for you :)

    There is also rivatuner another good tweaking application
     
  9. Kermit

    I have only ever overclocked this card a little in the past, core clock at stock is 250 and i changed that to 260 and the memory clock is 513 at stock whitch Oi changed to 523 and it done that with great ease, I know these ti cards are suppost to be really good at overclocking with the right cooling so I will take your advice and see how far it will go and be stable and cool at the same time. some one told me they had these ti4200 clocked to the same speed as a ti4600 and it was stable and the speeds were GPU Clock Frequency 300MHz and Memory Clock Frequency 650 MHz, buy the way here is a pitcher of my card on the msi site and it has the same fan as mine, well what am I on about it is the same card lol

    http://www.msicomputer.com/product/vga/vga_detail.asp?model=G4Ti4200-VTD8X
     
  10. I know your cooling will be alot better but mine seems to be good all the same, have you ever used any overclocking utilitys before, I got msi desktop and msi 3d turbo experience with my card but have never bothered to use it yet as I like to do it maually but if they are anygood maybe I will give them a try, I got easytune with my mobo allso but have not used that either yet as they allways seem to be hogging the system things like easytune, well thats what I have been told as I myself have not tried it but maybe I will.
     
  11. Shamus MacNoob

    Shamus MacNoob Moderator Political User

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    Yes thats the same as mine , you also got an application with the card called 3d turbo experience its on the drivers cd , you can use that to moniter temps and fan speed and also set an alarm if it gets too hot or if fan rpm's drop to low.

    Now as for overclocking its true these cards do overclock very well but again its all trial and error , need to bump up a little and run some benchmarks at one point it will start to act up and thats when you need to back off a notch.

    There are people finding out that with certain cards the default voltage has caused artifacts in games but when changed up from default the artifacts are gone. Seems that its on the bigger cards The FX's . And we are talking voltage in bios.

    I will see if I can produce some artifacts and then I will up the voltage and see if I have less ... I got nothing better to do right now anways lol
     
  12. Shamus MacNoob

    Shamus MacNoob Moderator Political User

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    I get better overclocking with the coolbits than I do with the MSI clocker that is with the MSI drivers , if you are using omega's like I said coolbits is there , if not get nvhardpage and enable all the options on the tweaks section.
     
  13. I just tried to overclock my card and it was saying failed when i just tried to move it from 513 to 560 lol then i tried again and it was ok lol, like you said it sometimes plays up for no reason and i will try with the coolbits overclocking utility now as that was with the msi one, so what did u think of the msi fan did it work ok for you or not as you have upgraded it and I was just thinking maybe i should do the same but somthing is holding me back and i will tell you why, I have a 2500+ 333fsb barton and it came with an amd heatsink and fan and the temp was 48 c, now I know its the middle of summer so i thought ok I will go out and buy a copper heatsink and i did and it was a big monster with a bad ass fan on it even the screws were made of copper and the dam thing is only down to 45 c, it dose go down to 39 c when it cools down the weather that is and no dowt when the summer is over it will go below that, but when the summer is here you can have the best fan in your rig and it dosent make a hole lot of good when its boiling hot in your bed room or ware ever your pc is, i know some fans are awsome like the ones that have been cut into the side of your rig but they are like top doller, im just saying in this weather it dosent make a hole lot of good as we are all getting higher temps i would of thought unless yu have a vapor chill.
     
  14. i think my card isnt overclocking so well tonight because my room is like a sorner lol
     
  15. just opened all my bedroom windows and the temp is down to 42 c and dropping lol I will give that coolbits ago tonight and get back to you tomorow some time ok thanks, I am allso in the middle of building a website witch is going to look good when its done ( I hope ) lol My mam got a lad from a website firm to come out and givew her a price for a website with a few pages and he said £650.00, So i told my mam to tell him to go take a jump as I would do it, I have messed around with webpages for my nascar server before and its so easy to do and theys guys charge the earth for it and I still live at home so I will do it for nothing and save her all that cash, maybe i will get a 3200+ clawhammer lol.
     
  16. I will give them tweaks a going over to so thanks for finding them.
     
  17. O one last thing on the omega website it says if you instal the omega drivers and then you start tweaking them all his work will have gone to waste as he said they are tweaked allready and if you try anymore his settings wont work, is this true or not as i have never tried yet, the quility is better with the omega drivers and its better than i have ever seen it and I just think for a ti it should do just that little bit more, what do you think of the quility of your ti, I know when I had my 9500 pro hercules the quility was exerlent but I eneded up giving it to my brother as it was playing up in this board when I got it as this is a new board and thats why I have the ti in here, plus this mobo takes the barton 333fsb and my other mobo never so i went with this mobo and the ti, but i sure miss my 9500 pro hercules lol
     
  18. Shamus MacNoob

    Shamus MacNoob Moderator Political User

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    I am very pleased with the Ti for the price it is a great card. As for tweaking drivers its true the omega's are pre tweaked. I wanted to give you a few applications you could look at I am sure your gonna be like any other Nvidia owner and play with the det's I mean we have so many sets to play with lol ... as for over clocking the card I prefere coolbits not the msi application provided with their drivers. I do like the 3d turbo experience its always nice to have all the cards info and voltages at a glance. And here is another fact some drivers overclock better than others , will it be the same set for you? So its all about playing with the dets and using some tweak app's , dont just go by 3dmark scores some guy might post a 14,000 but the image is crappy looking some guys just know how to get a good score but there game playing will be crappy. I pushed my Ti4200 and at one point at 2.25 Ghz I think it was I had the 11th best score overall exact match cpu/gpu with this card on my MSI K7N2G mobo , I have not even bothered to run a benchmark with my Gigabyte and that at 210FSB ... why cause I just dont care lol I am in the mood for higher IQ and deeper graphics at the moment

    Keep an eye on temps my stock fan crapped out , and I was not gonna risk my card so I got the better cooler . Its like a furnace here also these days and I am watching temps all over I am just a tad over my stock 166 FSB huh :)
     
  19. I have put the omega 43.45 in as whan i use the dets i think the 43.45 is alot better than the newer 44.03 and it gets a little more in the benchmark to with the same settings and the quility is a little better on mine, just one more thing do u use the sets from the MSI site or do you go to the nvidia site and witch do you think run the best as I know msi play with them a little to suite there cards but weather they make them any better or not would take alot of time finding out lol, so witvh ones do you go for and why, I allways find the card makers drivers are better but maybe they are just the same with msi extras in as i knopw the nvidia ones dont come with a overclocking utilaty unless u add coolbits.