The Return Of The King

[Not Bman]

Alright, I just finished watching the 3 movies, and bonus features and extended version and I have pretty much 1 main question.

I never read the books, and the thing that gets me at the end of the last movie is where are they going, why do they leave on the boat, and where are they headed? It's a sad ending, and I was wondering if there was more explanation somewhere..

 

[Sazar]

Watch the first movie again.

They are going to the undying lands.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Undying_Lands

 

[Not Bman]

Alright, thats where they went, but what exactly is it and what are they doing

and what.... (A very few non-Elves are known to have passed along this road, including Frodo Baggins, Bilbo Baggins, Samwise Gamgee, and Gimly) Sam and gimly never went?

 

[fitz]

put my answer in spoiler tags since I think some of the things I mention might be only in the extended editions..

Spoiler

Basically, they are going to the Valinor via the Grey Havens (Grey Havens is the port where the boat left) which is all the elves have gone when they left middle earth. It is mentioned briefly in (I think) the second movie when Arwen was on horseback about to leave middle earth with the rest of the elves and she sees her vision of her future son. It is also mentioned/allueded to, I think, briefly in the first movie when Frodo first leaves the Shire and camps in the woods and they see the elves (extended edition only!). Often referred to as the undying lands because only those the immortal's could reach it (with the exception of the bearers of the OneRing)

The elves (and Gandolf as the last wizard) are leaving middle earth because the time of magic and the elves has passed.. and it is moving into a new age (the age of men).

Most of the first two ages (the Lord of the Rings takes place during the third age of Middle Earth) aren't documented in the lord of the Rings books but in the Silmarillion. The First Age basically is the beginning of time on Middle Earth and is the emergence of Elves. The second age ends with the first fall of Sauron.

The Lord of the Rings books does go a little more into it but not into great detail about what it all is and what it all really means. The Silmarillion and the History of Middle-Earth series of books gets into more of the canon and world that makes up Middle Earth.

 

[Sazar]

Alright, thats where they went, but what exactly is it and what are they doing

and what.... (A very few non-Elves are known to have passed along this road, including Frodo Baggins, Bilbo Baggins, Samwise Gamgee, and Gimly) Sam and gimly never went?

Yep, plus Sam settled down and had a family, kids and all that in the Shire.

Gimli was a dwarf, afaik, his affiliation with Legolas and his assistance on the quest to destroy the One Ring allowed for him to also travel there but Tolkien doesn't specifiy.

 

[Not Bman]

That is great information and helps me out, and now I understand it a bit better.

I don't really like the idea of it, but to Tolkien it was history.

Alright here is another question, unless I was mistaken I just recently read that Tolkien's sons just finished the forth book. Is this true, and what would be in this book, what would the story be about.

 

[Sazar]

It's a different tale, so to speak.

The trilogy is complete. I guess you could say the Hobbit was a prelude (many elements were indeed) and the Silmarilion set things up (it did, but it's also the hardest book to sit and read through).

The new book is a different beast and a continuation of the work of Tolkien, from what I have understood of it. I haven't read it, nor do I intend to in the near future.

 

[Not Bman]

So the book "The Salmarilion" is an older book of all of writings about middle-earth put together. There is a new book then, after the last Lord Of The Rings?

I have many questions, and I don't expect you to answer, I just find his writings amazing and interesting.

 

[Sazar]

Not really.

It deals more with the mythos of a lot of the character, such as the "wizards" of which Gandalf was one, creatures such as the Balrog and a similar creature to Shelob.

It is really in-depth and the prose is not very "noob" friendly. It is infuriating at times if you do not have a decent vocabulary and have a pre-conceived notion of what the book is about. Let me put it this way, if you can read a Salman Rushdie book and not need a dictionary or thesaurus, you should be fine with the Silmarilion 🙂

Likewise for the unabridged version of LoTR. That is the primary reason I am not into reading books at the moment. I read the whole thing in one fell-swoop over a weekend (less in fact) and it just burnt me out. I had read it in bits and pieces but I was physically drained after reading all 3 books in one go 😱

 

[Not Bman]

Well thanks for the info and such, I found a pretty good site with forums and everything you would ever want to know about LOTR's, so if I have any more questions I will ask it there.

Thanks.

 

[Sazar]

Cool.

Understand that there are a lot of people with different views on events/happenings and the like.

This is why Tokien's family has not really been able to publish something without added scrutiny because it was HIS world and HIS mythos 🙂

The new book is supposedly the most faithful reproduction of his prose thus far. Like I said, I'd have to read it and compare it to the original text of LoTR and the Silmarilion.

The Hobbit, imo, was basically a kids book.

 

[Not Bman]

Yea I was also told that the Hobbit was a kids book and LOTRs is much different. Which I have tryed reading those books and never got though like the Hobbit.

Thanks.

 

[fitz]

The Hobbit was written to be more of a kids book (along the lines of the Narnia series).. speaking of which, go look up what Tolkien thought of the Narnia series 🙂 (note: Unlike Tolkien, I like the Narnia series though..)

The Lord of the Rings series was written as, technically, as one book with 3 acts and, as mentioned, is a much harder read. The Similiarion is an even harder read because it's not story so much as history. The "Unfinished Tales" is actually mostly Tolkien original work with little more changed other than names to keep the names consistent. Tolkien often tried different names for his characters throughout the writing and would settle on a name and change the earlier names in later drafts.

 

[Sazar]

Narnia was fun 🙂

I read it when I was a kid and I was hooked 😀

I can't wait for the other books to be made into movies, although I fear that the Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe is possibly going to remain the most accessible of the books to the audience.

 

[Not Bman]

The Hobbit was written to be more of a kids book (along the lines of the Narnia series).. speaking of which, go look up what Tolkien thought of the Narnia series 🙂 (note: Unlike Tolkien, I like the Narnia series though..)

The Lord of the Rings series was written as, technically, as one book with 3 acts and, as mentioned, is a much harder read. The Similiarion is an even harder read because it's not story so much as history. The "Unfinished Tales" is actually mostly Tolkien original work with little more changed other than names to keep the names consistent. Tolkien often tried different names for his characters throughout the writing and would settle on a name and change the earlier names in later drafts.

I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that Tolkien was good friends with the writer of Narnia...am I not correct?

 

[fitz]

you were correct.. they are good friends.. they were also competitors in a sense (both were writers). Much of their debates centered around some the Christian overtones in the books (in case you didn't know, both authors held deep Christian beliefs and both series contain many and varied Christian references/allusions).

http://www.thestonetable.com/articles/220,1.html

In CS Lewis, Beyond Narnia, Lewis and Tolkien are shown having a violent argument about The Lion, The Witch and The Wardrobe. Lewis wrote afterwards: "No harm in him, only needs a smack or so."

Tolkien disliked the first Narnia book, published in 1950, telling the author it had too many clashing elements and was pushing the Christianity "message" too far. He also apparently "hated" Lewis's allegorical fight between good and evil, with Jesus represented by Aslan the Lion.

"Some people may see it as trading insults," said Stone. "Initially, when Lewis turned to writing children's books, his publisher and other friends tried to dissuade him. They thought it would hurt his reputation as a writer of serious works on literature and ethics.

"Tolkien thought there were too many elements that clashed: a Father Christmas and an evil witch, talking animals and children. He did not like allegory and thought Lewis's book was too pushy in a Christian sense."