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Seria ATA vs IDE

Helmer

Questions R me
#1
I just ran a test of my HD's with HD tune 2.0, here are the shocking results:

HD Tune: MAXTOR 6L080L4 Benchmark (IDE)

Transfer Rate Minimum : 1.5 MB/sec
Transfer Rate Maximum : 3.3 MB/sec
Transfer Rate Average : 3.1 MB/sec
Access Time : 14.1 ms
Burst Rate : 3.3 MB/sec
CPU Usage : 76.5%

HD Tune: Maxtor 6Y120M0 Benchmark (SATA)

Transfer Rate Minimum : 29.8 MB/sec
Transfer Rate Maximum : 57.1 MB/sec
Transfer Rate Average : 46.6 MB/sec
Access Time : 13.9 ms
Burst Rate : 94.8 MB/sec
CPU Usage : 12.7%

Unfortunatly the IDE HD is the one with the OS installed on. I suspected that it was the HD that dragged they system down and now I confirmed that suspition.

The reason I installed my OS on the IDE HD was that it failed to find the ATA HD, I tried the disk with the drivers on it - but alas, my diskdrive is broken.

So my question goes: Does anyone know how to install WinXP on an ATA HD without a diskdrive?
 

RickyC

OSNN Addict
#2
You could take a Ghost image of the drive and ghost it onto the new drive or in the bios select to boot from SCSI/RAID on your SATA channels.

Your results for the IDE drive are very low, the OS shouldn't slow a drive down that much!!
 

Helmer

Questions R me
#3
Yea I know it's way too slow, just don't know why. I run fully updated versions of AdAware and NA2004 on a regular basis and they come up clean(except for a few tracking cookies now and then ;) - Got any ideas on that? hehe

I'll try to look in the bios for that option - Thanks man!!
 

Sazar

F@H - Is it in you?
Staff member
Political User
#4
wow... the ide's cpu utilization looks to be a little on the high side there...

when I run hdtach, I hit about 25-30% or so...
 

ming

OSNN Advanced
#5
Well, when you buy a HD, you should already know the difference from what's printed in the specs. e.g. UDMA100/133 or SATA150.
Not sure if I should feel shocked by the figures shown as I think the IDE figures are misstated when you ran the tests. There's no way that any would be able to transfer 100mb to the IDE drive within seconds (like most IDE drives would do) at the rate stated above.
 
#6
Holy hell, that's slow! How old is that drive? That's even lower than you'd get in PIO mode...

If you need drivers for the SATA you'll need a floppy drive. I've tried with usb stick, but I couldn't get that to work.
 

Helmer

Questions R me
#7
Well I honestly don't remember how old it is - 4 years perhaps? In either case, I', going to order Maxtor DM10 160GB, ATA, 7200RPM, 8MB this because I need space - then I can throw the IDE HD away.

So I can make a Ghost Image of a partition? Then I can test it on the ATA drive I have.

While I'm at it, I need to add to my memory as well and were looking at Dane-Elec Varenavn: 512 MB PC3200 DDR400 Model: D1D400-06464 - are they k with the memory I have?

Thanks a lot for the help guys, you know I recommend this site to everyone I know that has issues *thumbs up*

Btw, Ming, it dosen't take my IDE drive secs to transfer - it really is very very slow. It wasn't always like this, it slowed down recently.
 
#8
Helmer said:
So I can make a Ghost Image of a partition? Then I can test it on the ATA drive I have.
You could, but since your installation doesn't have the SATA drivers, you'll get a bluescreen on bootup because it can't find the drive.

Also, please don't write "ATA". Both IDE and SATA are ATA (IDE is PATA). ;)

And something is seriously wrong with that IDE drive. I can't imagine how slow your computer must be right now!
 
#9
That speed on the IDE drive sounds like DMA is disabled for the drive and your transfering through the processor instead of straight into RAM. That would explain the problem with cpu throughput Sazar noticed.

Right click my computer select manage then device manager. Open IDE ATA/ATAPI COntrollers and select the IDE controller, right click and select properties. Then select the primary tab disk drives then right click on the IDE and select properties. It should show UltraDMA X as selected or at least DMA X. If it says PIO that is your problem. Set the bios to autoselect the correct mode.

Other possibility is if you are running an optical drive on the slave of your primary channel it can be slowing it down. Keep all non-DMA type devices (optical drives, zip, removables, etc.)off the primary channel.
 

emeritus

Beware the Monkeys!!!
#10
The IDE drive is an ATA133. Make sure you have an 80 wire cable on it, and double check the the DMA. VIA do have IDE drivers, which should run the drive at full speed. Just a note, the 133 is for burst mode not sustained transfer, same with the SATA drive. But, no matter what, the IDE should be posting at a lot higher transfer rate. If it helps any the drive should be seen as a mode 6 drive in your BIOS. Judging by your motherboard it does support it.
 

Helmer

Questions R me
#11
Leejend, you hit the nail - it's set to PIO Mode, I've selected DMA if available and checked the bios. I couldn't find anywhere to let the bios control this and rebooting didn't change it.

I'm pretty sure it has an 80 wire cable.. they came with teh motherboard
 

Maveric169

The Voices Talk to Me
#12
You might want to check and see if there is a update for you bios then, you should be able to tell it to run in DMA mode or PIO mode. Unless for some wierd reason it is a PIO mode only HDD, which I have never heard of.

If none of that works there is a reg hack that you can do to force it to address the drive in DMA mode. I can't find the link that I had with the instructions, I will keep looking maybe someone else has it here.
 

Helmer

Questions R me
#13
Thanks Maveric, I have the latest BIOS for my mobo. It comes with an autoupdate feature :D

But unless I'm being a total moron, I can't see anywhere in the bios where I can set DMA/PIO - It's just not there...
 
#15
Drivers from 2001 on a K8T800? Yes you probably should then. The drivers should have come with the motherboard. Since it's VIA it should be the 4-in-1 driver methinks. :)
 

Helmer

Questions R me
#16
Yea, I'll get on updating the drivers.

Actually I got it to run DMA, I noticed that my CD drive were set as master so I changed the jumpers and now the HD is master and it auto-detected and set DMA in windows.

I haven't noticed any increase however, I'll update the drivers - then run the test and see what the result is :)

Again, thanks for the help!
 

Helmer

Questions R me
#17
Ok, installing the latest VIA 4in1 didn't update the IDE/ATA/ATAPI controllers driver.

But here are the results on the HD, big improvement - but I should still replace it right?

HD Tune: MAXTOR 6L080L4 Benchmark

Transfer Rate Minimum : 8.0 MB/sec
Transfer Rate Maximum : 39.8 MB/sec
Transfer Rate Average : 32.6 MB/sec
Access Time : 12.7 ms
Burst Rate : 80.2 MB/sec
CPU Usage : 4.8%
 
#18
Hey, now we're talking! :) That looks much better.

I suggest you don't use it as a system disk at least, but for storage it's still ok. Depending on how big it is of course, how big is it?
 

Maveric169

The Voices Talk to Me
#20
Yea it is still good for storage, I used to have an 80 gig for that. Those numbers look much better. When I recently tried to update my IDE drivers (VIA also) I couldn't seem to either, not sure what is up with that.
 

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