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can't move temporary internet files

Perris Calderon

Administrator
Staff member
Political User
#1
so using vista, I want to move the temp internet files to the desktop so I can defrag just that file cause perfect disc won't do it through the navigation window for some reason

so I do everything I think I'm supposed to do, tools, internet thingys, move file

I created a file on the desktop called "temporary internet files" (cool name right?...thought that up on my own)

the computer does it's thing, logging off to make the move, when I log back on, temp files are still mapped to the original file

any ideas?
 
Last edited:

American Zombie

Administrator
Staff member
Political User
#2
If this is with IE open maybe you need admin. Right-click the IE icon in the start menu then "run as admin" or whatever it says (not on Vista right now so can not remember what it says).
 

Perris Calderon

Administrator
Staff member
Political User
#3
If this is with IE open maybe you need admin. Right-click the IE icon in the start menu then "run as admin" or whatever it says (not on Vista right now so can not remember what it says).
will try that but I would think I would get a notice telling me I don't have authority if that was the problem

good suggestion, will let you know manana
 

falconguard

Carbon based lifeform
Political User
#5
Can you right click on the folder and edit all permissions there?

Properties>Security>edit and manually edit the folder for full control under your profile.
 

j79zlr

Glaanies script monkey
Political User
#9
Why are you trying to defrag your temp files, they are just going to get deleted and recreated???
 

Perris Calderon

Administrator
Staff member
Political User
#10
Why are you trying to defrag your temp files, they are just going to get deleted and recreated???
unless you set the file to delete on closing the browser they don't get deleted they get replaced, as the folder reaches the limit the oldest files get replaced by the newest

this file is most dynamic, always changing, of all files to defrag I think these are the most important
 

j79zlr

Glaanies script monkey
Political User
#11
Right, as the files get deleted and replaced they will use the next available space. Those files would have the highest probability of being fragmented unless you clear that space, defrag the rest of the drive, and then allow the temp files to occupy new space after compacting the rest of the drive. Personally I like using modern file systems that do not need to be defragmented ;)
 

Perris Calderon

Administrator
Staff member
Political User
#12
Those files would have the highest probability of being fragmented unless you clear that space, defrag the rest of the drive, and then allow the temp files to occupy new space after compacting the rest of the drive.
even that protocol wouldn't prevent the temp internet file from fragmenting j79

as far as the entire file, being fragmented wouldn't present an issue as far as I can see, the data inside the temp file are the issue, if that data is fragmented across the file or the hardrive, that's gonna give a performance hit me thinks

I remember when I had the file on it's own partition for this same purpose, the files in the temp file still get fragmented

so how does the Linux file system solve the problem?

I know you know why in windows there's a fragmenting problem j79, but let me restate it for those that are reading this thread that might not understand what's going on...I can't figure out how a more sophisticated file system would address the issue;

the temp files are written as they are seen by the os, they aren't written contiguously in the first place, that's an internet packet thing not an os or files system thing;

suppose a gif is seen, it will hardly ever get seen all at once, but let's say it is for arguments sake, even that doesn't help, that gif, or a portion of, it will get written if that's the entire packet the os looks at right then, if the gif isn't contained contiguously on the internet transfer, it can't get written contiguously, it will get written as the packets arrive, and as they are seen in Que

compound that fragmenting issue with the fact that the gif might get written and accessed often, then right beside it some data might get written that's only accessed the once, say a rotating banner, and written directly adjacent on the drive

since that data isn't accessed but the once, it'sn gonna get occupied by new data long before the gif that's accessed often gets overwritten

files that were written after the banner but are more active are still going to be there after the banner is replaced

so even if the entire drive is empty, the files within the drive get fragmented no matter what you do
I can't see how a file system can overcome this physical and practical reality

unless the file system were always defragging files as they are written

that to me is counter productive, creating far too much hardrive activity

files systems and os's are sophisticated enough that they know where the fragments are long before they seek, they are accessed long before they need to be read, therefore, typically there is not allot of performance issue with fragmented files

so there's the quick lesson for everyone else, I know you knew all this

but you are saying the issues, however slight, don't even exist on the Linux file system?

are you also saying there isn't even a defrag program for Linux since files don't get fragmented?

and if so, why wouldn't Microsoft steal that technology?
 
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j79zlr

Glaanies script monkey
Political User
#13
NTFS is leaps and bounds better than FAT when it comes to fragmentation. And it was stolen from HPFS or the old OS2 filesystem. I am not an expert in this, but this is how I understand it. The advantage that ext3, reiser or ufs have is two fold. They leave buffer space around the file so it can be enlarged without having the fragment the file. Hard drive geometry is also taken into account, so if you have a contiguous file, it should not cross track boundries or platters. AFAIK, FAT32 does neither of these things and NTFS does the first poorly and does not take geometry into account.
 

Perris Calderon

Administrator
Staff member
Political User
#14
NTFS is leaps and bounds better than FAT when it comes to fragmentation. And it was stolen from HPFS or the old OS2 filesystem. I am not an expert in this, but this is how I understand it. The advantage that ext3, reiser or ufs have is two fold. They leave buffer space around the file so it can be enlarged without having the fragment the file. Hard drive geometry is also taken into account, so if you have a contiguous file, it should not cross track boundries or platters. AFAIK, FAT32 does neither of these things and NTFS does the first poorly and does not take geometry into account.
leaving a buffer around a file makes sense, it's going to use exponential more hardrive but that's easily overcome by claiming that buffer area when the hardrive gets full

thanx for the info
 

Perris Calderon

Administrator
Staff member
Political User
#17
well, I might as well try to do this with firefox

could someone tell me how to move the temp files from that browser?

I can't find it in tools
 

Perris Calderon

Administrator
Staff member
Political User
#19
Can't you just navigate to the firefox profile folder and tell it to defrag the cache files?
possibly, when I tried it with ie the it wouldn't highlight

where is the file in firefox?...program files, mozilla firefox?

I can't find a profile folder there
 

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Perris Calderon wrote on Electronic Punk's profile.
Ep, glad to see you come back and tidy up...did want to ask a one day favor, I want to enhance my resume , was hoping you could make me administrator for a day, if so, take me right off since I won't be here to do anything, and don't know the slightest about the board, but it would be nice putting "served administrator osnn", if can do, THANKS

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