So, how will a MacBook Pro work in a uni?

Discussion in 'Macintosh' started by Omnibus, May 10, 2008.

  1. Omnibus

    Omnibus OSNN Junior Addict

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    I'll be going to a university (currently as an engineering major, probably will change to biz or econ.) this fall and currently, I am pretty sure that I'll be purchasing a Vista for it.

    However, I've ben hearing how Macs are just as, if not more powerful for university students too. I know that it is a great solution at home, but is it really worth buying a Mac for a uni, considering the special programs that you might have to install for classes?

    Thanks.


    - Omni
     
  2. Sazar

    Sazar F@H - Is it in you? Staff Member Political User Folding Team

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    If you have a Mac with Office installed, you should theoretically be fine for most items.

    Not sure if you can run bootcamp of the Macbook pro's but if so, you can have Vista installed and use your engineering applications as well.
     
  3. dorfire

    dorfire OSNN Junior Addict

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    You can run Boot Camp under a MacBook Pro, so you should be just fine :)
     
  4. Mizzle

    Mizzle Oh, now I know...!

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    A guy in my class is using a MacBook Pro for school stuff. Doesn't seem to be working very well with most of the school hardware and systems. I'm not sure though, as he's not one of the studious students, if you get me...

    :)
     
  5. MuziKid

    MuziKid Lurking & Learning

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    My friend's going to college and his teacher actually uses his macbook. So maybe you'll get lucky enough to have a teacher using one too.
     
  6. Bigstie

    Bigstie OSNN Junior Addict

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    I guess you need to check the compatibility with your new school's systems first. Or simply take your chances, buy a Mac and run Parallels or BootCamp
     
  7. muzikool

    muzikool Act your wage. Political User

    Don't forget that Macs used to the de facto choice in educational settings, of course that was in the pre-OS X days when the Mac OS sucked. Anyway, you can install XP or Vista using Boot Camp, so I see no reason not to use the MacBook Pro and have the best of both worlds. :)
     
  8. Mizzle

    Mizzle Oh, now I know...!

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    FYI, BootCamp isn't perfect. The guy in my class room tried installing a game on XP via BootCamp, which didn't work. He then tried to install DirectX 9, and after a lot of prompts, that failed as well.
     
  9. X-Istence

    X-Istence * Political User

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    BootCamp is an emulation environment for the BIOS so that Windows XP can boot (technically not required for Windows Vista anymore since it supports EFI).

    Thus BootCamp has absolutely NOTHING to do with whether or not a game will install properly, since after Windows XP is booted the rest of the MacBook [Pro] will look like just a standard off the shelf Windows XP machine.

    Please have "the guy in my class room" re-install his Windows XP and tell him to stop installing free "shareware" that banner advertisements tell him are required.

    Oh, what game would this have been?
     
  10. Mizzle

    Mizzle Oh, now I know...!

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    Look, I ain't no idiot on this, so please stop talking to me like I am. I'm well aware of what it is, and what it does, and doesn't.

    You think I'm making this up, don't you? He hardly ever uses the XP part of his machine, and I think he knows that he shouldn't press that kind of stuff. Do you?

    The game was Rollercoaster Tycoon 3 - or am I making this up as well?
     
  11. X-Istence

    X-Istence * Political User

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    "ain't no idiot" ?

    Please, butcher the English language some more! I am a foreigner too, so don't even try pulling the "English is my second language" card.

    Even if you did make it up, which kind of seems like you are, seeing as how you are quick to attack me when I point out flaws in your argument against BootCamp, I was just pointing out the fact that BootCamp has nothing to do with the software that runs on top of Windows XP, thus the problem is not with BootCamp in any way shape or form.

    Having used BootCamp with Windows XP, and having run many different games on it (Half Life 2, TF 2, Portal, Quake 4, Hitman: Blood money, and many others, including older versions of Rollercoaster Tycoon), I find it impossible to believe BootCamp is the issue, more likely an inexperienced user.

    You did after all mention he had been having all kinds of other trouble as well:

    PEBKAC.
     
  12. Mizzle

    Mizzle Oh, now I know...!

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    Would "I am not an idiot on this" make you feel better?

    There are no flaws in my argument. There are compatibility problems with Windows on Macs via BootCamp, and that's it. Seeing how you react, I bet you're a die-hard Mac fanatic.

    Like I said, I've been using computers for a long time now. About 12 years - 4 of these on a high-level of understanding most things about them. I'm not inexperienced in any way, so please get that thought out of your head.

    He has problems with the school printers, school network as Macs apparently can't be use the certificate the school uses. Other applications, such as MathCad, is working fine with BootCamp, but DirectX 9 isn't, and the same goes for RollerCoaster Tycoon 3.

    If this is the kind of attitude you, an admin, have towards new members, who are telling the truth, then I don't want to be here. Keep it up with this kind of friendliness towards other people, and I'm sure you'll make it some day. Or not. Pathetic...
     
  13. X-Istence

    X-Istence * Political User

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    You seem to be taking this awfully personal ...

    Sure, you may call me a die-hard Mac fanatic, I however am able to see flaws in Mac OS X, and Apples products. I like Mac OS X since it gives me a stable work environment that I don't need to sit around and tweak, or worry about the registry, or compiling new packages. But give me FreeBSD any other time of the day. I much prefer it over Mac OS X, but usability comes before play, especially when one needs to get work done.

    That being said, BootCamp has absolutely nothing to do with the OS running on top of it once the OS is booted. Over the years I have had trouble using Windows on standard off the shelf hardware, including the things you mention. DirectX 9 not installing, games not installing, or something along those lines. All of them were solved by either figuring out what I had done wrong, or by re-installing the OS (which should never be the solution).

    You are quick to point the finger at BootCamp as the culprit, but you seem to be unable to come up with something that actually concretely proves your point.

    MathCad is a Windows application, so off course it will run fine on Windows. Once again I say, BootCamp has nothing to do with the OS once the OS is booted. All it does is emulate the BIOS so that Windows XP is able to boot. I still FAIL to see how BootCamp is the source of problems with installing Rollercoaster Tycoon 3 and or DirectX 9 (Which BTW is part of Windows XP, since SP2, so it is already installed).

    As for problems with printers, that is an entirely different story. Having to work with my Mac on my schools network I have had to find ways around problems that exist in Mac OS X. Bonjour enabled printers work just perfectly fine, which is most HP printers these days.

    You seem to take this very personal, yet this is supposed to be a guy in your class (not even a friend it seems). You seem to specify that you are telling the truth multiple times, which if you were you would not be concerned about. Seems rather odd.

    You asked me to stop talking to you like you did not know anything, yet I had only posted one reply. I never questioned your knowledge in any of my post, other than that what BootCamp is and how it works.

    As for experience, high-level understanding? What is that supposed to mean? Even if you are not inexperienced, you seem to have mistaken BootCamp for something it is not. Once Windows XP is running on Mac hardware (be it MacBook, MacBook Pro, Mac Pro, iMac or any other Apple hardware that supports it), it is just Windows. BootCamp does not even come back into play. So saying there are incompatibilities between BootCamp and Windows does not make sense, especially since BootCamp has nothing to do with DirectX 9 or any games the user installs.

    My reaction was not "this guy is inexperienced", my thought was "this guy has been misinformed, let me reply tongue-in-cheek" after which you took it seriously since the Internet is serious business.

    Really, I don't really care how long or how experienced you are in the field of computers, there is always something you will be wrong on, something you will learn. I have an extensive background in computers, and am going to the University to study Software Engineering, Robotics and Embedded systems. That does not mean squat unless I can prove it.

    I am sorry that you feel that I have an attitude with new members, really I don't. It is part of my personality to just speak my mind, I feel that tip-toeing around in a circle is not going to do me much good. If you are unable to take criticism and a bit of sarcasm that is not my problem.

    Give me specific examples of how Rollercoaster Tycoon 3 and or DirectX 9 not installing are problems within BootCamp, and I will gracefully accept that I was wrong, and award you the proper recognition you deserve.

    I already am making it. I won't need to wait till "some day". If you feel the need to leave, please don't let the door hit you on the way out. It would be a shame if it was accidently damaged.
     
    Shamus MacNoob likes this.
  14. Omnibus

    Omnibus OSNN Junior Addict

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    Umm... maybe back to the topic. :)

    X-Istence, you mention something about Vista supporting EFI in your post. Is that supposed to mean that without this Bootcamp thing, I can install Vista on MBP? Sry, a n00b with Macs--which is exactly why I want to get one, but not sure if it'll help me throughout college.

    Thanks!
     
  15. Perris Calderon

    Perris Calderon Moderator Staff Member Political User

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    x-istance I am a know nothing concerning macs or environments so answer this for me please;

    my box has has hardware compatibility issues if I go to xp, I have to install drivers that are not native or even recognized to be needed by xp

    wouldn't this be even more true on mac hardware?

    I think drivers are going to be an issue even if the OS is running perfectly

    I do believe that might be one of the points of the op
     
  16. X-Istence

    X-Istence * Political User

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    The Mac OS X Leopard DVD comes with all the required drivers required for Windows XP to recognise and utilise the hardware that comes with Apple hardware.

    Apple hardware in this case is like any other hardware you are able to buy, it requires drivers for the Sound card, graphics card and other such utilities, however this has nothing to do with BootCamp. As for being more true, no, it is going to be just as true as any other machine. If I bought a laptop from Lenovo with the exact same hardware specifications as that is available in the MacBook Pro as an example, I would be installing the same drivers. (Ignore the fact that the Lenovo laptops would not come with EFI)

    Apple however has a limited selection of hardware, and thus they are able to ship all the drivers required for Windows on the DVD and have it be guaranteed to work. The drivers however will still not account for problems installing games or DirectX 9, as once again they are a completely separate entity.
     
  17. X-Istence

    X-Istence * Political User

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    Sure, you can install Vista on your MBP.

    http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/irony/macbook-pro-is-the-fastest-windows-vista-notebook-317060.php

    If you step through the "Boot Camp Assistant" it will let you partition your drive from Mac OS X, and then you will want to follow the directions given.

    http://www.apple.com/support/bootcamp/ contains more information.
     
  18. dorfire

    dorfire OSNN Junior Addict

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    I just wanted to state that a Mac would help you just like any other computer.
    As you've probably understood by now, you can install any operating system you like (including other UNIXes) and use any program you like, so don't worry about compatability issues :)
     
  19. Mizzle

    Mizzle Oh, now I know...!

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    @Omnibus,

    sorry about shortly changing the subject. I think I've resolved it via PM with X-Istence. Hope you're ok :)
     
  20. Geffy

    Geffy Moderator Folding Team

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    I installed Vista Ultimate x64 SP1 on my MacBook Pro the other weekend and aside from a bit of driver hunting (my OS X DVD only came with 32-bit BootCamp) I've got it all running perfectly. HL2: Episode One plays very nicely as does Tomb Raider and Unreal Tournament 3.

    You do have to jump through a few hoops though to get it to work though. Firstly even though Vista Ultimate SP1 does support EFI it doesn't work with the MacBook Pro's. I suspect this might be because Vista supports UEFI 2.0 and the MacBook Pro's are on EFI 1.1.

    Either way you end up with a useless boot prompt and the keyboard doesn't work. So you need to use another windows machine to reburn the Vista DVD with some different options and then download the drivers + bootcamp 64 installer to get it all to work.

    If you're only going with the 32bit version of Vista then you won't have these problems as EFI is only supported on 64bit SP1 afaikfftcm* and you can happily use the Vista drivers included on your OS X DVD. Once you've installed them though then you should download the BootCamp 2.1 drivers as the stability of a couple components, especially AirPort, is improved.

    Note though that at the time VMWare does not support running a 64bit BootCamp installation in a virtual machine, but I suspect this will be added in the near future.

    *as far as I know, feel free to correct me

    [edit]: I've uploaded the BootCamp 64bit drivers to my own hosting space now. Links available in my blog post about the process of getting Vista SP1 x64 onto a MacBook Pro.
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2008