Pledge of Allegiance --- Petition

Originally posted by xsivforce
Did anyone know that Elvis died on my 7th birthday? He also had a stinky butt.

I did not die, and I do not have a stinky but...I had a stinky when I was still addicted to drugs, but I no longer have a stinky but...now myfujism ..I couldn't tell you if that's stinky, as I've never had a comment either way
 
Originally posted by Etakos
You Still Here Ikester? Why dont you spread your right-wing-psycho-fantasy-propaganda somewhere else. Or better yet ..get a AK47 and go fight some "heathens" ...please? I have been following your posts since ya came here, and its more of the same garbage. I think lot of ppl would agree. BTW, nice avatar (spit)

You sir, are the one who needs to go.
 
You know it's strange that this is due to the policy of seperation of religion and state.
When all of your ancestors came to this country, they were fleeing religious persicusion. I say your ancestors cause mine were always here (Native American and Hispanic). But once your ancestors established the government we have today and began expanding this nation they sure as $h!7 kramed it down our throats and if we did not convert we were killed. Most European nations when they explored they always tried to ram their religious beliefs down the throats of the inhabitants. There has never been a seperation of religion and state. They profess this but there is always an underlying presence. When someone gets on the stand in a Court of Law what's the first thing they make you do? "Swear to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help me 'god' " on a Bible. Why doesn't someone say, "I can not say that becuse it contradicts the seperation of religion and state rule"? Hmmmm? Our money... "In god we trust" Jeeeezzz, Where is the seperation? 2 words have created a stupid arguement. Don't we have more trying problems to worry about? Like people blowing up our buildings and killing our citizens. Poverty, starvation, unemployment, housing, health and welfare, our youth and the way they're killing themselves off, etc... I think our energies can be and should be directed towards more important issues, than 2 words. Patriotizm come for within, not from a phrase or a poem or a song. We have them, we use them, but if someone can not be patriotic on their own or feel it on their own, then they should pack their bags and leave this country. Patriotizm should ALWAYS be in you. PERIOD!
 
Re: seperation

Originally posted by zoloto
The clause in the constitution was never a "seperation of church and state" as it's so commonly mistaken. It means there will be no State sponsored religion. Remember europe about 200 years ago and how they forced it on EVERYONE? Yeah that's what they were insuring here, that it WOULDN'T happen as it did then. Just because there are religious people in government office doesn't mean we have to replace them with pagans/athiests/agnostics/jews/christians.

 
yes, when you get ona wior tness stand, you do not have to swear, nor make any mention to or about god, the courts have long ago recognized this duplarity...you can "AFFIRM" that you will tell the truth.

As far as seperation of church from state, that is the defining that has come through the evolution of our constitution, and how very wise a defining it's been, we don't have the bin ladens, or the al kedas running our nation do we.
 
Strange that when the United States was expanding into the western areas they continually force feed the indiginuos population with their religious beliefs. If my ancestors did not comply they were branded Pagans, Heathens, Savages. We were systematically absorbed or killed off.
We had to speak the language, believe in the same god, their god and dress the same way. Or else!

But that was then, but it was already part of the constitution as that there will be no State sponsored religion.

If that wasn't State sponsored Religion then what was it?
We had to believe in their god. Or else!

Oh well. :(
 
gonaads I hear you bro, and I feel your pain.

Our country doesn't have that clean of a track record, but certain people only want to look at the positive and not the negative. ie, slavery and the native american problems.


my two cents, but what this country did to those two races of people is unexcusable. :(
 
May not be clean... So why dont we all move to Irag and see how thing change for ya !!!!!


:confused:
 
Where do I begin?

Let me first state that I am Athiest...but, I have absolutely no problem with saying the 'Pledge of Allegiance'. I take great pride in this country, and I believe that is what the 'pledge' is designed to do...sort of create a 'Esprit de Corp'.

Chief said it the best......The Pledge of Allegiance in my mind is a tool, used by the government and the people of this great nation to encourage patriotism and to help people appreciate the life they are allowed to live. It is nothing more than that.

Apathy will be the death of this country. Lest we forget, the Roman Empire lasted for 800 years. The United States has only been around for a little over 200 years.

As articulated by Joshua.....I have been reading all the responses to this thread, and I am very dismayed at how disrespectful people are to this great country. The pledge of allegiance is more than just a saying. It is stating the morals and values our country was founded on, and recognizing them. You think we are the greatest country ever by mistake? No, it is because of our strong tradition, and morals.

Values and standards are the guardrails in human culture. With all of the garbage that kids are subjected to in school today, to have them recite a 31-word pledge to the flag of their country - for people to find this objectionable is a sign of just how our culture is changing. This country is responsible for the prosperity everybody living in it enjoys. It is this country; it is this Constitution; it is this flag that is the beacon to the oppressed people around the world


I stated that I am Atheist. I am, but I do not force my views of religion on my children. My children do not even know what my views are. They go to church and I encourage it. Religion can and does teach some very good values, ethics, and morals. When they become adults, they will be free to make up their own minds based on their personal knowledge and experiences, not ignorance. How can you make a decision...when you don't know both sides of the issue?

But I do speak to them about their country. We as parents have a responsibility to pass on "PRIDE".

Again referring to Joshua's statement.....Every generation that is born in this country has a responsibility to pass on to its successors all that they inherited. I see nothing wrong in Americans defending America, and understanding what's great about this country and wanting to protect it for their kids and their grandchildren. I don't understand people who don't see the importance of this. I certainly don't understand people who are threatened by it.
 
Originally posted by Famine
May not be clean... So why dont we all move to Irag and see how thing change for ya !!!!!


:confused:

I agree, if it bothers you that much....GOODBYE!

Noone is holding you back.
 
originally posted by Gonaads:
When someone gets on the stand in a Court of Law what's the first thing they make you do? "Swear to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help me 'god' " on a Bible.

I'm afraid your mistaken there gonaads. I am a Police Officer, and unfortunaletly find myself in court often. They no longer require you to state "so help me God". That's just in the movies. :D
 
Originally posted by Iceman38
gonaads I hear you bro, and I feel your pain.

Our country doesn't have that clean of a track record, but certain people only want to look at the positive and not the negative. ie, slavery and the native american problems.


my two cents, but what this country did to those two races of people is unexcusable. :(

Every child (Country) makes mistakes. The key is to learn from your mistakes. They're called "Growing Pains".
 
Originally posted by Armis36


Every child (Country) makes mistakes. The key is to learn from your mistakes. They're called "Growing Pains".


More words of wisdom from Americas Finest....Thank You for your service Armis.
 
Originally posted by Grinder714


I agree, if it bothers you that much....GOODBYE!

Noone is holding you back.

I was wondering how long before someone stated this, thanks Grinder714, you just proved my point. We all have to think the same way u do right?

Armis36, I'm sorry but no true Athiest would even consider sending their children to a church.

Let's all act like blind sheep and do whatever you "good" religiuos folk want!!!

Say the Pledge in the comfort of your own home, teach your children how you want to teach them, leave MY children alone in school, they are being sent there to learn, not to be brainwashed and recite meaningless pledges. You don't have to say a pledge to show you love this country, this is for people just to "show" off, keep your religion to yourself.

As far as learning from mistakes, have we really learned from our mistakes? because you people continue to want to force people to say things against their free will.
 
Originally posted by Iceman38
Armis36, I'm sorry but no true Atheist would even consider sending their children to a church.

I find it funny that you say that nobody should be told or forced what to believe, and yet you have the gall to tell me what 'I' believe.

And to clarify...I don't "send" my children to church. I allow them. It is their decision.....Hasn't that been YOUR whole argument!
 
And to clarify...I don't "send" my children to church. I allow them. It is their decision.....Hasn't that been YOUR whole argument!

I'm sorry I read too much into your arguement, I was under the impression you sent them there. I offer my apology.
and by the way I do respect yours and everybodies else opinion on this matter. :)
 
Thank you Iceman...my faith in our Super Hero has been restored...:D
 
Originally posted by Iceman38


I was wondering how long before someone stated this, thanks Grinder714, you just proved my point. We all have to think the same way u do right?




Obviously you are reading too much into that too....I am merely saying, don't just sit there and complain, do something about it.
That is what is so great about this country.

And if you feel that guilty and oppressed...maybe try another country, just so you have a balanced point of view.
 

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