just to start some trouble (*warning*politics)

[j79zlr]

He won fairly, you guys had Michael Moore types and lawyers everywhere waiting for something to pounce on, and you know what happened, nothing. I'm sure the French feel for you Perris.

 

[Xie]

He won fairly, you guys had Michael Moore types and lawyers everywhere waiting for something to pounce on, and you know what happened, nothing. I'm sure the French feel for you Perris.

Michael Moore types? Whats Michael Moore have to do with anything? I also remember seeing stats on TV of the number of lawyers/planes fueled and ready/funds marked for legal battles. Guess who had more of each .. you guessed it Bush. Also how can you say he won fairly when it can't even be proven as many machines used don't even have an audit trail? Is it fair because he ended up with the larger number in the end and "your team won"?

 

[j79zlr]

You guys are unbelievable.

 

[Tuffgong4]

It's over. Nothing is going to change. What should be more worrying to the democrats is their loss of seats in the house and senate. That will have more of an effect than the president.

If we talk politics we should start talking about who is going to be the candidates for 2008. Barack Obama for the dems, or the awful idea of Hillary Clinton. That makes me cringe. Maybe McCain for the Reps, only problem is that he has tried and failed but I really would like to see him gain support

 

[rotjong]

It's over. Nothing is going to change. What should be more worrying to the democrats is their loss of seats in the house and senate. That will have more of an effect than the president.

You are correct. It is over. And though many won't say Bush was given a mandate something clearly shifted.

I don't believe Bush got a mandate but the Democratic party definitely was handed a message.

[beginning of a somewhat lengthy statement and not just a reply to Tuffgong4]

The Democrats lost their senior-most Senator in Texas. Yes, he was screwed because they re-districted and he was stuck in a Republican district but he did lose.

Daschle lost and he was the Minority Leader. I don't think much needs to be said on this. It's a telling sign to see this happen.

The Democrats lost multiple seats and they lost the election for President. This comes down to many issues and beliefs and it goes beyond abortion and gay marriage even if most of the media wants you to believe that.

I am in my early 30's, I'm Caucasian, I'm pro-choice [as long as it is not used as a repeated birth-control method by morons], I'm pro letting gays get married if they want, I'm pro death penalty [with limitations].

I didn't vote for Bush just because, gosh golly, he's fighting terrorism. I looked at both candidates and I read up on things. I listened to interviews in their entirety. I listened to what they didn't say when answering questions. I looked at issues independently and didn't group them together and decided which issues meant more or less to me. Bush didn't win my vote so much as Kerry lost it and he lost it majorly.

In the end each person is entitled to their own opinion and I respect that and people who don't agree with me.

If we talk politics we should start talking about who is going to be the candidates for 2008. Barack Obama for the dems, or the awful idea of Hillary Clinton.

Obama has thoroughly impressed me. I watched his speech at the DNC and was extremely interested. He has a bright future ahead of him but he also has a few hurdles. He needs to be part of a rebuilt Democratic party that can give him the Southern and Mid-Western support that he needs and he needs to age a bit and gain some more experience. The final hurdle and one that I find to mean nothing at all is the most obvious one of all... he isn't Caucasian. Sadly, there are still idiots out there who wouldn't vote for him due to this.

I wouldn't vote for Hilary, period. She's not the person they need to raise up as the next President and it has nothing to do with her gender.

Maybe McCain for the Reps, only problem is that he has tried and failed but I really would like to see him gain support.

By 2008 I will likely be a registered Republican and I will definitely vote for McCain if he runs again.

The most surprising thing I saw this election year was among my Democratic and Republican friends. Both sides had such solid lines drawn in the sand about issues when it came to Bush and Kerry but if McCain's name was brought up every single person said they'd vote for McCain. I won't speak for people outside my group of friends but that was an amazing statistic. McCain might be able to do what no one has in far too long... bring everyone closer together.

rotjong

 

[j79zlr]

I voted for Barak Obama, where's Perris?

 

[Geffy]

<voice character="Yoda">Much red, much anger in this one</voice>



sorry couldnt resist, plus the fact that I am slightly drunk and my brain is mush from many hours of coding Java, I should really be writing my report now

 

[Zarband]

I'd have to agree that the main loss was in the house and senate. Those seats cost the Dems more than losing the Presidency. I Personally, I'd like to see Colin Powell run for office, I think he's got a good head on his shoulders (even tempered and logical) and he's got experience in the white house at an upper level. Unfortuantely he's got two strikes against him, one was mentioned before about Obama, being the race issue, to me it's insanely stupid to judge someones merit or ability on their skin color, but yes there are those out there who's entire opinions of people are based on just that. Secondly, he's been almost entirely discreted but the conflicts in the middle east. Doubtful he'd ever even get nominated, or be in any position of power in politics again.

 

[Xie]

You guys are unbelievable.

?

It's over. Nothing is going to change.

Exactly. I for one find that scary, when change is what we need in a big way.

I also can't believe more people aren't upset about the voting situation. Your vote and thousands of others might not have even counted and thats fine with everyone apprently. Why hasn't there been any talk of correcting our voting system? Is it because Bush won that "everythings cool"? What about in 2008 when "we" can't vote for Bush? Then will it be a problem?

 

[Zarband]

Xie, whats more scary to me is the way we as a society turn our heads when things stop affecting us, or never do. One good example would be what happened in Rwanda a few years back, or what happened in Bosnia with Milosovik, asked on the street these days most people wouldn't even know where Rwanda was, and would probably respond with a grunt to the name Milosovich. Once things stop affecting them they cease to care. 9/11 chilled a lot of bones, and the day after everyone wanted afghanistan destroyed (so to speak) but 6 months later these same people are rioting and protesting agianst "innocent" civilians being killed over there. I look at the whole presidency the same way, it's a stagnant complacency thats washed over americans as a people, they stand up and say *vote or die* then the day after the election they shrug and walk off defeated. It's that "attitude" that scares me more as a human being than who actually won the election or how they won it.

 

[Perris Calderon]

I think some of the most interesting things are...and this .
.

if that storty and those numbers are correct, then America is under seige

I don't know if that article is genuine, or those numbers official...yet if they are...oh my.

I wonder what thepatriot or j79, or anyone that supports Bush has to say if that article and those numbers are correct

I'm betting there are people that claim to be patriots that don't care, as long as Bush won

witch of you are among those?

 

[Perris Calderon]

and if that article are true, and we are under seige, who is it that has taken us?

my first guess would be the same people that were told (in official government documentation) that we were about to be attacked, yet refused to protect us

I'm guessing it would be the same people that were implored to immediatly attack the aggresors in afghanistan once we were attacked, yet refused, and instead tried to send our boys and girls to Iraq

My first guess would include those people that made beleive we were fighting terrorism in Iraq when before we got there there was none...and those that yet managed to give terrorists 600 tons of military weapons and equiptment

My first guess would be those people

I'm not sure who that was...anyone have an idea?

 

[Petros]

Kerry conceded. Why can't you?

 

[ThePatriot]

if that storty and those numbers are correct, then America is under seige

I don't know if that article is genuine, or those numbers official...yet if they are...oh my.

I wonder what thepatriot or j79, or anyone that supports Bush has to say if that article and those numbers are correct

I'm betting there are people that claim to be patriots that don't care, as long as Bush won

witch of you are among those?

As I have stated before, my biggest reason for not wanting Kerry in office is because of the way he compromised his integrity towards his comrades after his Vietnam service. If the election was rigged in any way, I will be the first to demand a recount or re-election, and if it is proven that Bush did not win and Kerry did, then I will support putting him there. I will NOT compromise my integrity by supporting a cadidate that did not actually win.

HOWEVER...I have not seen enough evidence to support that theory, and lets face it here gentlemen...if the Election was questionable in ANY way, you KNOW there would be visible public outrage over it by the candidates. Kerry/Edwards just being tightlipped about it and conceding to a false election does not fit the bill. Moore would be on every talk show that would let him be there, and he'd crash the ones that wouldn't , so he could cry havoc. It's just not happening guys. Sorry, but so far it looks like a bunch of sour grapes. Maybe that'll change, but not hearing any of the candidates affected by this possibility crying foul, I don't put much weight on it.

As Unwonted stated...Kerry conceded and hasn't said a peep since. Looks like the bottom line to me.

 

[Xie]

As I have stated before, my biggest reason for not wanting Kerry in office is because of the way he compromised his integrity towards his comrades after his Vietnam service. If the election was rigged in any way, I will be the first to demand a recount or re-election, and if it is proven that Bush did not win and Kerry did, then I will support putting him there. I will NOT compromise my integrity by supporting a cadidate that did not actually win.

HOWEVER...I have not seen enough evidence to support that theory, and lets face it here gentlemen...if the Election was questionable in ANY way, you KNOW there would be visible public outrage over it by the candidates. Kerry/Edwards just being tightlipped about it and conceding to a false election does not fit the bill. Moore would be on every talk show that would let him be there, and he'd crash the ones that wouldn't , so he could cry havoc. It's just not happening guys. Sorry, but so far it looks like a bunch of sour grapes. Maybe that'll change, but not hearing any of the candidates affected by this possibility crying foul, I don't put much weight on it.

As Unwonted stated...Kerry conceded and hasn't said a peep since. Looks like the bottom line to me.

Evidence is all over. The problem is that we have gotten to this point where the media has conditioned everyone to think that one that questions the administration is automatically "anti-American". I think questioning how things work is American.

Also many are asking for recounts in many states (ie. Florida, Ohio, ect.). I saw that Kerry's lawyers are going to be doing a recount of ballots in Ohio NOT challenging them as well.

As far as you that are infatuated with Michael Moore he has begun work on "Fahrenheit 9/11 1/2" and expects to have it done in 2-3years. I myself could care less as it's stuff that is already public record for the most part. However those that are extreme Bush seem to have a hard-on for this guy so now they can mark the calendar for the next time they can start with the anti-American banter.

 

[Perris Calderon]

Kerry conceded. Why can't you?

if the numbers in that link are correct;

this isn't a question of who is now president...this isn't a question of weather or not you like or dislkike kerry

this isn't a question of weather or not you think Bush's polocies are good or bad

this is a question of America being under seige...and anyone thinking that's fine

 

[chastity]

Well I found this links that seem cast doubt on the way the election was done. You don't have to agree or disagree with what they say but think about it

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/1106-30.htm

http://www.tompaine.com/articles/kerry_won.php

http://www.bushoccupation.com/

 

[Perris Calderon]

chastity, this country is under seige, I am now convinced.

untill someone gives me an explanation how there could be more votes then voters, it will appear to me that this is a fact

 

[Tuffgong4]

all these posts about how there are more votes than voters and that there are suspicious things going on are quite frankly poor losers. If any of that information were true there would be much more coverage of the fact in the news and the democrats would be fighting in public so that the general public could know about it. It is also silly to put any weight in a website called Bushoccupation.

The only problem I see with this country is that there aren't any truely unbiased places to find information any more and even the people who put their time and money into research have their words misconstrued by both sides to make it look like it favors one side or the other.

and Xie

Exactly. I for one find that scary, when change is what we need in a big way.

as of right now there just aren't that many people who feel like you do. A lot of people came out and voted for George Bush. If change is what we needed so badly John Kerry would have won. It's as simple as that

 

[Perris Calderon]

exit polls are never wrong...how interesting they're wrong in those states that there is no paper trial.

how alarming is this?...yet there is no alarm.

could you imagine the media frenzy that would be happening if these events happened for Kerry?

what wouold hanidy be doing? or rush?...the media would be going nutz wouldn't they

yet there is no alarm...very interesting

the "poor losers" of this country are those that think this is not something to investigate.

I have no idea if the exit polls were wrong or not...nobody has any idea...yet.

I am toatally awed that anything of that magnitude could be pulled off...that's the reason I hold my reservation...I'm hoping beyond your imagination that none of this is real

HOWEVER

if the numbers that have been reported as official are in fact official, then this country is under seige...yet there are people that don't want to even try to find out if that's so or not so