9800SE or 6200?

Discussion in 'Graphics Cards' started by canadian_divx, Jun 28, 2006.

  1. canadian_divx

    canadian_divx Canadian_divx

    what one of these cards would perform better?

    ATI 9800SE 256 AGP
    380 Clock
    340 Memory

    Asus NV6200TD 256 AGP
    350 Clock
    500 Memory


    anyone have any opinions on this that are technical? and not just a ati or NV bias?

    i would run 3d mark on it but i am unable to turn the pc off for about 2 days.
     
  2. ShepsCrook

    ShepsCrook Red Sox Fan!

    Messages:
    1,489
    Location:
    Knightdale
    The 9800SE is better. But not by much. You're better off going with a 9800Pro which will smack the 6200 back into 5 years ago.
     
  3. LeeJend

    LeeJend Moderator

    Messages:
    5,291
    Location:
    Fort Worth, TX
    Neither. Get a used 6600 Gt or 9800 Pro.

    Both are brain dead, crippled up cards.

    If you must get something new get a 7300GS at $73 USD. It has twice the fill rate of the cards listed.
     
  4. pokerblogger

    pokerblogger OSNN Addict Folding Team

    Messages:
    125
    Location:
    Portland
    The 6600 is SM 3.0 and its a good card, I have a lot of experience using the 6600 and 6800 both of which are excellent. I wouldn't recommend an SM 2.0 card as you'll miss out on a lot (i.e. dynamic branching).
     
  5. ShepsCrook

    ShepsCrook Red Sox Fan!

    Messages:
    1,489
    Location:
    Knightdale
    I'm just suggesting based on what he asked about. If he had asked about other options for cards, I would say a 7950GX2, or dual 7900GTX cards, or wait until DX10 cards are available. :p
     
  6. LeeJend

    LeeJend Moderator

    Messages:
    5,291
    Location:
    Fort Worth, TX
    What is the point of dynamic branching on a card that is so slow it will be annoying in 2D let alone 3D?
     
    pokerblogger likes this.
  7. pokerblogger

    pokerblogger OSNN Addict Folding Team

    Messages:
    125
    Location:
    Portland
    What card are you talking about? Annoying in 2D? Have you ever used/owned a 6600? Here's my 2c in order from my experience (top card is favorite and these are ONLY cards which I have extensive personal experience)

    NVIDIA 7900 GTX
    3Dlabs Wildcat Realizm 800 (OpenGL Only)
    ATI X1900
    NVIDIA GeForce Go 6800 GT
    NVIDIA 6600
    3Dlabs Wildcat Realizm 200 (OpenGL Only)
    ATI 9800 Pro All In Wonder
    ATI X800 (driver stability issues when I used this)
    ATI X300
     
  8. Sazar

    Sazar F@H - Is it in you? Staff Member Political User Folding Team

    Messages:
    14,905
    Location:
    Between Austin and Tampa
    On Topic, the 9800se would probably be the card to pick but yes, if you can spend a little more, go for something like the 9700/9800 pro series.

    Off topic, dynamic branching doesn't net much benefits when you are choking in high LOD, shader-intensive situations as is the case with nv4x marchitecture. SM 3.0 is a decent benefit when you are looking at a few games for HDR, i.e. Far Cry, but there is a penalty for the branching. It is not "free".

    Understand also that in many (if not most) situations, you can emulate or "fake" the effects without a net loss in overall performance. I have personally not suffered negatively from trading up from my nv40.

    The benefits of dynamic branching == same work in fewer passes == speed boost, theoretically. But the branching itself STILL incurs a cost on nv40 hardware. You have to move up to the next level to gain a net-benefit because of the improved performance of the quads wrt instructions.

    As such Leejend is correct in saying that the benefits of things like dynamic branches don't truly apply. You are going to have to move to newer marchitecture like the g7x derivatives to see a TRUE benefit w/o performance penalties like those seen in the nv40.
     
  9. pokerblogger

    pokerblogger OSNN Addict Folding Team

    Messages:
    125
    Location:
    Portland
    So you think the Radeon 9800 is a better card than the GeForce 6600GT?

    Maybe its just the difference in opinion between a graphics developer specializing in shader development and an end user?
     
  10. LeeJend

    LeeJend Moderator

    Messages:
    5,291
    Location:
    Fort Worth, TX
    A 9800 PRO is equal or better than a 6600GT.

    We were talking about a 9800 SE which is brain dead from the factory.
    Having had both I would take the 6600 GT over a 9800 SE any day.

    My comment was directed at the choice between a 9800SE and a NV6200TD. Neither card is worth the money spent. Stay with on board video until you can afford a real accelerator card.

    Pretty graphics don't do you any good at 10 FPS in game, neither card will adequately support Vista destop and even Windows XP with all the desktop features turned on will be sluggish on screen updates.
     
  11. pokerblogger

    pokerblogger OSNN Addict Folding Team

    Messages:
    125
    Location:
    Portland
    This is entirely incorrect. It's hard for me to see how you can even compare these two cards, the 9800 is a GENERATION behind the 6600! Since you aren't listenening to me . . . take a minute to read this article.

    ATI Radeon 9800 Pro vs. NVIDIA GeForce 6600GT

     
  12. Shamus MacNoob

    Shamus MacNoob Moderator Political User

    Messages:
    4,199
    Location:
    L'Ile Perrot Quebec
    The 6600gt is a fine card very good for the money .
     
  13. Sazar

    Sazar F@H - Is it in you? Staff Member Political User Folding Team

    Messages:
    14,905
    Location:
    Between Austin and Tampa
    No, I think that the 9800se is a better product than the 6200. And I don't think dynamic branching is a benefit to either card given the raw pixel pushing capabilities of both.
     
  14. LeeJend

    LeeJend Moderator

    Messages:
    5,291
    Location:
    Fort Worth, TX
    Poker

    A friend of mine who went from the 9800 PRO to the 6600 GT strongly disagrees with that review. He thinks the 9800 PRO "looks" better than the 6600GT. He also doesn't like how fast the 6600GT FPS degrades as AA and AF are increased due to it's choked down 128 BIT memory bus.
     
  15. pokerblogger

    pokerblogger OSNN Addict Folding Team

    Messages:
    125
    Location:
    Portland
    What game(s)?
    What resolution(s)?
    What settings?
    What about driver settings?

    Could be a bad card your friend got - or his driver settings. I spent months benchmarking these and that article is fairly accurate compared to what I've seen. There might be some corner cases but you're talking about a revolutionary step in the evolution of discreet graphics cards, these two generations are quite different. I don't think its right to suggest to someone to get something as ancient as a 9800 if they can get a 6600 for around the same price. Fixed function graphics cards are almost old hat entirely now and wouldn't personally suggest them to anyone anymore.

    For the record I OWN a 9800 and use it in my World of Warcraft rig. It's a great card . . . would I swap it for a 6600 GT? YOU BET. In fact, if anyone wants it PM me and I'll trade your for your 6600 GT.
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2006
  16. lancer

    lancer There is no answer! Political User Folding Team

    Messages:
    3,093
    Location:
    FL, USA
    the 9800pro 256mb s by far the better card... i own one an it actually looks better in most situations (my own opinion), than the 6800.
     
  17. pokerblogger

    pokerblogger OSNN Addict Folding Team

    Messages:
    125
    Location:
    Portland
    Well, it's like comparing a horse and carriage to a car. I won't argue the point anymore but saying the 9800 Pro is better than the 6800 is simply obnoxious.
     
  18. Sazar

    Sazar F@H - Is it in you? Staff Member Political User Folding Team

    Messages:
    14,905
    Location:
    Between Austin and Tampa

    The 6600 perhaps but not the 6800. The 6800 has 12 pipes and has better/more advanced shaders and better shader performance than the r3xx based cards. The 9800pro was a great card but that comparo is simply erroneous m8.

    My old 6800ultra OC, while not leaving me oohing and aahing compared to my old 9700pro, was significantly faster. Just like my current card is.
     
  19. Shamus MacNoob

    Shamus MacNoob Moderator Political User

    Messages:
    4,199
    Location:
    L'Ile Perrot Quebec
    Yes the 6800 is a better card , I had the 9800 pro and the 6800 and the 6800 was a whole different game.
     
  20. lancer

    lancer There is no answer! Political User Folding Team

    Messages:
    3,093
    Location:
    FL, USA
    well perhaps i had a dodgy 6800, because, i feel my 9800pro performs better, irrigardless of the specs. but thats just how i feel.