Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then

**ShepsCrook** · September 25th, 2007

http://www.efluxmedia.com/news_Did_Y...hen_08977.html

**Electronic Punk** · September 25th, 2007

To be honest if you mess around with any kind of firmwares and break a device you should not be able to return goods.

**ShepsCrook** · September 25th, 2007

I think that people are going to be unhappy, but it's their own fault for spending money to change their phones, and then expect them to work forever. Just as long as the companies that charged them for the phone had a disclosure saying that if Apple releases firmware updates, they are not responsible for any loss of use because of such updates.

**Grandmaster** · September 25th, 2007

^ Products you mess around with shouldn't be covered by warranty, but that doesn't mean they should shut off the device.

**Electronic Punk** · September 25th, 2007

As the article says they are more interested in making money from O2 (here in the UK) than making it open and retailing it like everyone else.

40% of the revenue I believe, I don't know how much of the actual profit that works out but I suspect any costs will come out O2s side.

More than likely the reason they don't care about hacking it until it actually looked like they should. They sold the phone with the contract so they are getting their cut.

**perris** · September 25th, 2007

Originally Posted by Grandmaster

^ Products you mess around with shouldn't be covered by warranty, but that doesn't mean they should shut off the device.

that's the point, they are going out of their way to make the hack not work

makes me wonder how this company get the fanboys defending it the way they do

**gonaads** · September 25th, 2007

Originally Posted by perris

that's the point, they are going out of their way to make the hack not work

makes me wonder how this company get the fanboys defending it the way they do

They prolly won't defend Apple after this.

**muzikool** · September 25th, 2007

More FUD as usual. Apple is NOT intentionally and proactively killing these unlocked phones -- the company is simply warning that futures updates to the phone may render them inoperable. Apple has no reason to develop the iPhone updates in such a way that works around these hacks.

Apple's Phil Schiller was quoted by an Associated Press article about today's announcement that SIM Unlocked iPhones may become permanently disabled by upcoming iPhone updates.

Schiller clarifies that this is not an intentional move to disable unlocked iPhones:
''This has nothing to do with proactively disabling a phone that is unlocked or hacked,'' Phil Schiller, Apple's senior vice president of worldwide product marketing, said in an interview. ''It's unfortunate that some of these programs have caused damage to the iPhone software, but Apple cannot be responsible for ... those consequences.''

To clarify, this appears to affect iPhones that have been specifically SIM Unlocked to use other carrier SIM cards besides AT&T. iPhones otherwise "hacked" to install 3rd party applications are unlikely to be affected in the same manner.

Additionally, there is already published information on how to reverse the hack, so anyone who wants to prevent this issue is able to.

**Sazar** · September 25th, 2007

Originally Posted by muzikool

More FUD as usual. Apple is NOT intentionally and proactively killing these unlocked phones -- the company is simply warning that futures updates to the phone may render them inoperable. Apple has no reason to develop the iPhone updates in such a way that works around these hacks.

Additionally, there is already published information on how to reverse the hack, so anyone who wants to prevent this issue is able to.

Apple cannot void the warranty for any updates that are not actually putting the phone at risk. There is nothing hard-wired in the phone that should prevent it from operating on a compatible network. If anything, what Apple is suggesting (re: warranty voiding) seems blatantly illegal.

Additionally, there have been updates since the first releases of these "hacks" and there have been no issues with the phones. If Apple is now claiming that the phones may be rendered inoperable, there is little to read into that than those hacks are being specifically targetted.

Again, this seems a very strong-arm tactic and, once again, seems illegal.

However, the last line in the little snippet you posted suggests this may be limited only to the cards using other carriers SIMS. Given that the SIMs are using the same circuitry and general layout, I fail to see how using a SIM card from another carrier can cause issues.

**Grandmaster** · September 25th, 2007

^ Companies get away with that all the time. Sony with the PSP, and Microsoft with the 360 both take similar tactics and create software updates to nullify software hacks.

**Sazar** · September 25th, 2007

Originally Posted by Grandmaster

^ Companies get away with that all the time. Sony with the PSP, and Microsoft with the 360 both take similar tactics and create software updates to nullify software hacks.

Well, there is a difference in nullifying the hacks (i.e. returning the product to the original state) v/s voiding the warranty and essentially saying the product will be destroyed.

Microsoft only said that re: hardware modded xbox's and they have the right to refuse service on their online platform for modded system due to potential cheating issues (which were rampant with modded systems). Can say similar things for the PSP.

But the threats levied here do seem of an entirely different nature given that the hacks are software and are not damaging the hardware present, just opening that hardware to be used on similar networks.

**muzikool** · September 26th, 2007

Like I said, I don't expect Apple to included workarounds in their updates to prevent the update from creating issues with the hack. It seems to me that Apple is giving a good heads-up to all iPhone hackers so they can remove the hack before the update. Just think what would happen if Apple didn't warn anyone and all of a sudden peoples' phones were rendered useless. I think it Apple really wanted to stick it to these people then the company wouldn't have issued this warning in advance.

**Sazar** · September 26th, 2007

Oh come on.

<warning, all your base are belong to us, kthxbye> is hardly customer-centric.

The iPhone is claimed to be a mini-computer. You don't see microsoft shuttin down people's computers coz they are hacking stuff? You see the feds going after them if there is a law being broken. HP, Dell and others also don't start doing weirdo things to systems if they are out of spec or using non-recommended ways to do things.

**muzikool** · September 26th, 2007

Hmm... I'm not sure. I see both sides of the argument as pretty legitimate. I guess we'll see what ends up happening, how the public responds and how that affects Apple.

**gonaads** · September 26th, 2007

I think Apple is putting out the word sozz the guys out there hackin the iPhone have time to update their hacks for these ummm, updates. Or sozz people can re-lock their phones, do the updates as they come and then unlock them again. Most other Manufacturers wouldn't even tell you. They would just lock you out and say, "Oh, you hacked your phone. Now it's a brick? Well go buy another one".

Could be subtle way of giving the hackers a heads up. Me thinks anyway. Or maybe just wishful thinking?

Also, are these updates mandatory automatic? Or can you set manually and choose not to update? The way I see it is if the phone is working as it should (be it with another service provider), who in their right mind would do an update and fudge it it all up?

**muzikool** · September 26th, 2007

That's pretty much what I was thinking g.

I'm not sure if the update is mandatory or not, but I do know that it adds the iTunes Music Store to the iPhone, so I'm sure most every iPhone user will want the update.

**falconguard** · September 26th, 2007

The update will be mandatory, since it will also update the ITunes, that makes you buy a ring tone twice, There is just no way of getting around that. Unless, you are quite happy to not connect to Itunes ever again.

**muzikool** · September 26th, 2007

Yeah, that whole ringtone thing is a joke. Good thing there are 3rd-party apps that will do this.

paNix3d · September 27th, 2007

dang that one ring tone twice just made apple a lot richer.... thats alot of ring tones

**muzikool** · September 27th, 2007

UPDATE: The iPhone software update has been released, and Apple is actually recommending that people with unlocked iPhones not install the update yet. Apparently the iPhone development team is working on software that will re-lock the phone, which will prevent the phone from potentially becoming a paperweight after installing the update.

September 25th, 2007	Top \| #1
ShepsCrook Red Sox Fan! Joined: September 2003 Location: Raleigh NC Posts: 1,484 Reputation: 590 Power: 125	Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then http://www.efluxmedia.com/news_Did_Y...hen_08977.html There's no place like 127.0.0.1 Antec P182b, i7 920, 12GB Ram,HD6870, X-Fi Platinum, 128GB SATAIII Crucual, 2x 640GB AALS This is Bunny Dead ---> (\__/) No world domination <--(='.'=)--<< For him today.. hahaha (")_(")

September 25th, 2007	Top \| #2
Electronic Punk The Last High Joined: December 2001 Location: London Posts: 18,510 Blog Entries: 51 Reputation: 3652 Power: 349	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then To be honest if you mess around with any kind of firmwares and break a device you should not be able to return goods.

September 25th, 2007	Top \| #3
ShepsCrook Red Sox Fan! Joined: September 2003 Location: Raleigh NC Posts: 1,484 Reputation: 590 Power: 125	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then I think that people are going to be unhappy, but it's their own fault for spending money to change their phones, and then expect them to work forever. Just as long as the companies that charged them for the phone had a disclosure saying that if Apple releases firmware updates, they are not responsible for any loss of use because of such updates. There's no place like 127.0.0.1 Antec P182b, i7 920, 12GB Ram,HD6870, X-Fi Platinum, 128GB SATAIII Crucual, 2x 640GB AALS This is Bunny Dead ---> (\__/) No world domination <--(='.'=)--<< For him today.. hahaha (")_(")

September 25th, 2007	Top \| #4
Grandmaster Electronica Addict Joined: February 2002 Location: Santa Clara, CA Posts: 10,574 Reputation: 2960 Power: 260	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then ^ Products you mess around with shouldn't be covered by warranty, but that doesn't mean they should shut off the device.

September 25th, 2007	Top \| #5
Electronic Punk The Last High Joined: December 2001 Location: London Posts: 18,510 Blog Entries: 51 Reputation: 3652 Power: 349	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then As the article says they are more interested in making money from O2 (here in the UK) than making it open and retailing it like everyone else. 40% of the revenue I believe, I don't know how much of the actual profit that works out but I suspect any costs will come out O2s side. More than likely the reason they don't care about hacking it until it actually looked like they should. They sold the phone with the contract so they are getting their cut.

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September 25th, 2007	Top \| #6
perris OSNN Godlike Veteran Joined: January 2002 Location: new york Posts: 12,258 Reputation: 4333 Power: 291	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then Originally Posted by Grandmaster ^ Products you mess around with shouldn't be covered by warranty, but that doesn't mean they should shut off the device. that's the point, they are going out of their way to make the hack not work makes me wonder how this company get the fanboys defending it the way they do IT'S NOT WHAT YOU'VE DONE IT'S WHAT YOU ARE GOING TO DO

September 25th, 2007	Top \| #7
gonaads Beware the G-Man Joined: March 2002 Location: XP-erience, NTFS, OSNN, Bay Area, California Posts: 18,474 Reputation: 4070 Power: 348	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then Originally Posted by perris that's the point, they are going out of their way to make the hack not work makes me wonder how this company get the fanboys defending it the way they do They prolly won't defend Apple after this. *"I play violent video games, I could snap at any second."*

September 25th, 2007	Top \| #8
muzikool Act your wage. Joined: December 2001 Location: Texas, USA Reputation: Yes, please. Posts: 7,626 Reputation: 2900 Power: 232	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then More FUD as usual. Apple is NOT intentionally and proactively killing these unlocked phones -- the company is simply warning that futures updates to the phone may render them inoperable. Apple has no reason to develop the iPhone updates in such a way that works around these hacks. Apple's Phil Schiller was quoted by an Associated Press article about today's announcement that SIM Unlocked iPhones may become permanently disabled by upcoming iPhone updates. Schiller clarifies that this is not an intentional move to disable unlocked iPhones: ''This has nothing to do with proactively disabling a phone that is unlocked or hacked,'' Phil Schiller, Apple's senior vice president of worldwide product marketing, said in an interview. ''It's unfortunate that some of these programs have caused damage to the iPhone software, but Apple cannot be responsible for ... those consequences.'' To clarify, this appears to affect iPhones that have been specifically SIM Unlocked to use other carrier SIM cards besides AT&T. iPhones otherwise "hacked" to install 3rd party applications are unlikely to be affected in the same manner. Additionally, there is already published information on how to reverse the hack, so anyone who wants to prevent this issue is able to.

September 25th, 2007	Top \| #9
Sazar F@H - Is it in you? Joined: April 2002 Location: Between Austin and Tampa Posts: 14,888 Reputation: 4110 Power: 313	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then Originally Posted by muzikool More FUD as usual. Apple is NOT intentionally and proactively killing these unlocked phones -- the company is simply warning that futures updates to the phone may render them inoperable. Apple has no reason to develop the iPhone updates in such a way that works around these hacks. Additionally, there is already published information on how to reverse the hack, so anyone who wants to prevent this issue is able to. Apple cannot void the warranty for any updates that are not actually putting the phone at risk. There is nothing hard-wired in the phone that should prevent it from operating on a compatible network. If anything, what Apple is suggesting (re: warranty voiding) seems blatantly illegal. Additionally, there have been updates since the first releases of these "hacks" and there have been no issues with the phones. If Apple is now claiming that the phones may be rendered inoperable, there is little to read into that than those hacks are being specifically targetted. Again, this seems a very strong-arm tactic and, once again, seems illegal. However, the last line in the little snippet you posted suggests this may be limited only to the cards using other carriers SIMS. Given that the SIMs are using the same circuitry and general layout, I fail to see how using a SIM card from another carrier can cause issues. Help to find cures for Alzheimer's, Mad Cow (BSE), CJD, ALS, Huntington's, Parkinson's disease, and many Cancers. Folding@Home, is it in you?

September 25th, 2007	Top \| #10
Grandmaster Electronica Addict Joined: February 2002 Location: Santa Clara, CA Posts: 10,574 Reputation: 2960 Power: 260	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then ^ Companies get away with that all the time. Sony with the PSP, and Microsoft with the 360 both take similar tactics and create software updates to nullify software hacks.

September 25th, 2007	Top \| #11
Sazar F@H - Is it in you? Joined: April 2002 Location: Between Austin and Tampa Posts: 14,888 Reputation: 4110 Power: 313	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then Originally Posted by Grandmaster ^ Companies get away with that all the time. Sony with the PSP, and Microsoft with the 360 both take similar tactics and create software updates to nullify software hacks. Well, there is a difference in nullifying the hacks (i.e. returning the product to the original state) v/s voiding the warranty and essentially saying the product will be destroyed. Microsoft only said that re: hardware modded xbox's and they have the right to refuse service on their online platform for modded system due to potential cheating issues (which were rampant with modded systems). Can say similar things for the PSP. But the threats levied here do seem of an entirely different nature given that the hacks are software and are not damaging the hardware present, just opening that hardware to be used on similar networks. Help to find cures for Alzheimer's, Mad Cow (BSE), CJD, ALS, Huntington's, Parkinson's disease, and many Cancers. Folding@Home, is it in you?

September 26th, 2007	Top \| #12
muzikool Act your wage. Joined: December 2001 Location: Texas, USA Reputation: Yes, please. Posts: 7,626 Reputation: 2900 Power: 232	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then Like I said, I don't expect Apple to included workarounds in their updates to prevent the update from creating issues with the hack. It seems to me that Apple is giving a good heads-up to all iPhone hackers so they can remove the hack before the update. Just think what would happen if Apple didn't warn anyone and all of a sudden peoples' phones were rendered useless. I think it Apple really wanted to stick it to these people then the company wouldn't have issued this warning in advance.

September 26th, 2007	Top \| #13
Sazar F@H - Is it in you? Joined: April 2002 Location: Between Austin and Tampa Posts: 14,888 Reputation: 4110 Power: 313	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then Oh come on. <warning, all your base are belong to us, kthxbye> is hardly customer-centric. The iPhone is claimed to be a mini-computer. You don't see microsoft shuttin down people's computers coz they are hacking stuff? You see the feds going after them if there is a law being broken. HP, Dell and others also don't start doing weirdo things to systems if they are out of spec or using non-recommended ways to do things. Help to find cures for Alzheimer's, Mad Cow (BSE), CJD, ALS, Huntington's, Parkinson's disease, and many Cancers. Folding@Home, is it in you?

September 26th, 2007	Top \| #14
muzikool Act your wage. Joined: December 2001 Location: Texas, USA Reputation: Yes, please. Posts: 7,626 Reputation: 2900 Power: 232	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then Hmm... I'm not sure. I see both sides of the argument as pretty legitimate. I guess we'll see what ends up happening, how the public responds and how that affects Apple.

September 26th, 2007	Top \| #15
gonaads Beware the G-Man Joined: March 2002 Location: XP-erience, NTFS, OSNN, Bay Area, California Posts: 18,474 Reputation: 4070 Power: 348	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then I think Apple is putting out the word sozz the guys out there hackin the iPhone have time to update their hacks for these ummm, updates. Or sozz people can re-lock their phones, do the updates as they come and then unlock them again. Most other Manufacturers wouldn't even tell you. They would just lock you out and say, "Oh, you hacked your phone. Now it's a brick? Well go buy another one". Could be subtle way of giving the hackers a heads up. Me thinks anyway. Or maybe just wishful thinking? Also, are these updates mandatory automatic? Or can you set manually and choose not to update? The way I see it is if the phone is working as it should (be it with another service provider), who in their right mind would do an update and fudge it it all up? *"I play violent video games, I could snap at any second."*

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September 26th, 2007	Top \| #16
muzikool Act your wage. Joined: December 2001 Location: Texas, USA Reputation: Yes, please. Posts: 7,626 Reputation: 2900 Power: 232	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then That's pretty much what I was thinking g. I'm not sure if the update is mandatory or not, but I do know that it adds the iTunes Music Store to the iPhone, so I'm sure most every iPhone user will want the update.

September 26th, 2007	Top \| #17
falconguard Carbon based lifeform Joined: February 2004 Location: SoCal Posts: 3,406 Reputation: 2305 Power: 158	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then The update will be mandatory, since it will also update the ITunes, that makes you buy a ring tone twice, There is just no way of getting around that. Unless, you are quite happy to not connect to Itunes ever again.

September 26th, 2007	Top \| #18
muzikool Act your wage. Joined: December 2001 Location: Texas, USA Reputation: Yes, please. Posts: 7,626 Reputation: 2900 Power: 232	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then Yeah, that whole ringtone thing is a joke. Good thing there are 3rd-party apps that will do this.

September 27th, 2007	Top \| #19
paNix3d OSNN Junior Addict Joined: July 2007 Location: Wichita Falls, Texas, USA Posts: 28 Reputation: 0 Power: 60	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then dang that one ring tone twice just made apple a lot richer.... thats alot of ring tones Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual Core Processor TK-53 2Gb Ram Nvidia GeForce Go 6150

September 27th, 2007	Top \| #20
muzikool Act your wage. Joined: December 2001 Location: Texas, USA Reputation: Yes, please. Posts: 7,626 Reputation: 2900 Power: 232	Re: Did You Unlock Your iPhone? Bad News For You Then UPDATE: The iPhone software update has been released, and Apple is actually recommending that people with unlocked iPhones not install the update yet. Apparently the iPhone development team is working on software that will re-lock the phone, which will prevent the phone from potentially becoming a paperweight after installing the update.